Apologies if this has been asked before. I had a surprisingly peaceful conversation with my roommate this evening. I asked her what she thought democrats should focus on from this point forward to try and improve their popularity again. Similar to a lot of what i’ve read here she thinks an extreme left swing is needed. We disagreed on nearly everything. Her firearm stance is what surprised me the most. She wants the second amendment repealed and everyone’s firearms confiscated. in her eyes no one needs guns, and if no one has guns no one can get shot or killed. She also feels no one needs to hunt for food since supermarkets provide and we should save the wildlife.
Based on my time here, a lot of liberals are pro 2A, i am curious on how popular her belief is overall.
Thanks.
Comments
The following is a copy of the original post to record the post as it was originally written.
Apologies if this has been asked before. I had a surprisingly peaceful conversation with my roommate this evening. I asked her what she thought democrats should focus on from this point forward to try and improve their popularity again. Similar to a lot of what i’ve read here she thinks an extreme left swing is needed. We disagreed on nearly everything. Her firearm stance is what surprised me the most. She wants the second amendment repealed and everyone’s firearms confiscated. in her eyes no one needs guns, and if no one has guns no one can get shot or killed. She also feels no one needs to hunt for food since supermarkets provide and we should save the wildlife.
Based on my time here, a lot of liberals are pro 2A, i am curious on how popular her belief is overall.
Thanks.
I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.
Does anyone think “no one needs guns”? I’ve certainly never heard that outside of your roommate.
I want Democrats to be a big-tent party, and I imagine the members of that party would have a variety of different views on guns.
>Do some on the left still think no one needs guns?
Sure, but they are a tiny and unrepresentative minority.
I would say this is not a common stance. More gun laws and safety, sure. But many on the left own guns too.
I get the fear because of school shootings. I get it. But at this point in our history timeline it’s not feasible, nor do many of us on the left want it to be. There is no way I am giving up the right to protect myself and my family, especially now.
Edit because I wanted to add that I do not like the idea of altering our constitution by repealing at all.
Only weird utopians
I don’t think I’ve ever met a liberal who wants to wants to get rid of all guns. I’m sure they exist but I think most just want common sense regulations. I’m a gun owner, many of us are.
I’d be OK with repealing the 2A. I don’t think it was ever intended to be the suicide pact that right-wing jurisprudence makes it out to be.
I’m fine with guns for hunting and sports — even for self defense — but I support regulations that make them less deadly. I’d be fine with strict limits to magazine capacity, for instance. I’d also like to see registration and licensing.
Your roommate is basically a Pegasus, a legendary creature many talk about but almost no one has seen. My wife is one as well but literally the only person in real life that I’ve ever known to hold that position.
I’d say such a person is more likely to be on the left but I would be shocked to find out that you couldn’t find such people on the right as well.
However, if I were to press my wife on the subject I know she would concede that law enforcement should have guns and that farmers and ranchers should have guns. I might even get her to admit that some people could make a legitimate argument about personally needing a gun for individual self defense.
I think your roommate is wrong but is your roommate wrong in a monumental way? Not really. There are developed nations that basically outlaw guns and they are fine. People might choose to hunt and consume the meat but no one really needs to hunt for food. They have very low violent crime rates. Both have cultural reasons (or better put, incredibly terrible cultural reasons) for having high suicide rates. However basic gun regulations that slow acquisition of guns lower the rate of successful suicide a lot.
I want there to be no guns however I know this is not feasible. I’d advocate for no semi automatic guns like the AK rifles with no bump stocks (or whatever you call the larger magazines) and only handguns OR do like what is done in Japan and go through a lot of certifications on a yearly basis.
You can have guns if you want, but frankly the idea that having guns will protect you against a tyrannical government, which is the argument people usually make, is just pure fiction.
I am on the left but also very pro-2A. Talking with gun owners in my state (California) it does seem like a massive amount of votes are lost by democrats being anti gun.
Take a look at AB1127 in California or SB25-003 in Colorado for current examples of Democrats genuinely trying to take guns. It is very difficult to say “come on guys, nobody is coming for your guns” when people are, in fact, coming for them.
As we are trying to defend the constitution from Trump, it is difficult to also defend infringements on the second amendment by “our side”.
Personally, I run in mainly liberal circles. Aside from a handful of conservative in-laws, and a couple work associates, mostly everyone I know is liberal.
I have never heard a liberal say they want all guns removed from society. None.
I despise guns, gun culture, and the American infatuation with guns. If someone asked me to write about my perfect, ideal world, I would 100% repeal the 2A, confiscate all guns except for the strictest purposes (maybe deployed military, SWAT, native Americans, hunting licenses if you need them to provide food for your family and/or protect your livestock, for example).
However, I am not an idiot, and therefore I know this is not possible in the reality we currently live in. Therefore, my common sense answer is that I would vote for a candidate who supports sensible gun control / reform, in whatever form that takes. I would never go around advocating to get rid of all guns because I know it’s just not possible.
I’m still in favor of repealing the 2A and getting rid of as many guns as possible.
I think you would be surprised how many people on the left know how to use and own guns. My dick is big enough that my guns are not my identity.
One person can only fire one gun at a time.
We certainly need less guns. Zero? Maybe not. But the sheer volume in the guns in the US is just obnoxious compared to literally every other country
I get hunting with proper safety. But for self defense? I’d need to be able to pull and use a weapon under extreme stress and shoot the right target/person the right way. I think only if i were an experienced street cop would i assume i was in less risk with a gun vs me having a gun and shooting myself (accident or god forbid suicide), the wrong person or not hitting the bad guy and then shooting me or getting away. Shooting range is nothing like a real threat.
I think she’s in a weird urban liberal echo chamber. Most leftists where I live are pro gun tho that may be tainted by the fact I live in Iowa.
I mean, I’m fairly left wing, and I own guns. There’s even left wing gun subs on reddit (r/liberalgunowners, and r/socialistrifleassociation). I’m still pro gun control in the sense that I think guns should be registered and you should have a license to own and operate one. I also think anyone who’s getting a license should get a psych evaluation, a background check, and should have to take a class
I think that anyone who thinks they are going to buy enough firepower to outgun the police and/or military is insane and/or suicidal.
Complete repeal and confiscation as a tiny fringe position; the general position on the left is just ‘stronger regulation’ coupled with some tangential policy concerns (such as universal [mental] healthcare, more support for education and childcare, etc).
I’ve seen a fair amount of “I don’t see why people need guns” or “I think we’d all be better off without guns”, but that’s not quite the same as “We should ban all guns”. I don’t think I’ve met someone who has expressed that opinion.
Ask yourself this. If no one around you has guns and can’t get guns than why do you need one?
Common reasons given:
Hunting,
She made a point of you don’t need to hunt if you have food at the market. Hunting is also recreational. I think there would be ways to allow for hunting but not gun ownership (complicated for sure).
Protection,
Well if the person threatening you doesn’t have a gun they will use something else. Since you don’t have a gun you can use something else. They have a bat so you can have a bat as well. I feel we are just substituting weapons here. Counter argument I see is than should we get rid of all bats too. It the ease of killing someone that a gun presents that a bad would not.
Recreation,
A lot of people enjoy shooting guns. I can imagine a system that allows you to keep you gun and use you gun only at gun ranges. They are responsible for holding it. Also complicated and a lot of overhead. Also doesn’t allow people to shoot guns in their backyard.
A lot of things would be solved if guns were removed. There’s plenty of proof with other countries that don’t allow their population to own or carry guns. There’s lots of proof showing they have lower gun fatalities, school shootings, children shooting themselves while playing with them. There’s also all the owners who say “but I’m not the problem they are the irresponsible ones.“ That may be true. I’m not a gun enthusiast and don’t feel the need to own one either for any of the reasons listed above or not listed. I also don’t want to take peoples guns away. I don’t have a solution that will make anyone happy. I live in a country that allows it. But ask yourself. Do you really NEED a gun or just have been conditioned into think you have to have one because everyone else around you can have one. If it were possible to remove them and make it illegal to own or carry a gun it would be vastly more safe for everyone to be out an about and not worry about what guns bring to the table. Something else would fill the void for sure, but it would very likely be a lot less lethal.
‘Steps down from milk crate and walks away because it won’t get solved in my life time’
Hell yeah people believe that
They’ll say, “What do you need a gun for? ” incredulously
They’ll say ” only cops and soldiers should have guns”
It’s true some people feel this way
But they may have seen up close the real damage guns can do or have another reason to not want them for anyone
So ask the individual to find out more
I don’t think outlawing guns is realistic anytime soon, nor do I think it’s a good policy to push right now.
That said, I do think the Second Amendment should be repealed. I don’t believe there should be a right to use a gun for self-defense, it clearly doesn’t make our society safer. That being said, I have no issue with guns being used for sport or hunting, as long as they’re strictly regulated. There should be a reasonable balance of public safety and enjoying activities. I highly doubt allowing people to hunt will lead to significantly higher crime.
Well we might need them, you know…. To prevent a dictatorship.
I do not think anyone needs guns(other than law enforcement and military), but the cat is out of the bag, so the best I can hope for is more restrictions
I’m pretty liberal and think that’s the most stupid idea I’ve heard. Maybe explain to her that disarmed populations are easy to control and oppress. Is she not watching the news? Have her read this. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disarmament_of_the_German_Jews
My mother disliked gun so much, that I wasn’t even allowed to have toy guns.
I think everyone should be allowed shotguns and handguns and hunting rifles
My hope is that the “disappearing” of people off the streets by plain-clothed, masked people who refuse to identify themselves changes that attitude by those who are still on the fence.
Surely, you can disrupt fascism and authoritarianism without lethal force, but you can’t stop it.
My ex was like this but called themselves left of center.
I’m Australian. We’ve banned nearly all of our guns.
We still have guns. They’re just severely restricted. And we like it that way.
What are you going to do with guns?
I’m 100% for gun control, it’s common sense.
I don’t know if we really individually need guns in most situations, but the left needs trained and disciplined militias that are ready to stand up to any of Trump’s abuses of power. The next time ICE tries to disappear some innocent person just because they have tattoos, I want armed leftists outside the detention facility very politely asking they rectify their mistake.
We definitely don’t need to hunt for food, and hunting is massively bad for the environment. Let’s get that out of the way quickly.
As for the rest, I think she is correct, but not realistic. This country would be unequivocally a better place with no second amendment and confiscated guns. That’s just correct. What is not really sensible is the politics of it.
Most western countries don’t allow individuals to carry guns for protection. They don’t descend into chaos. I appreciate that the US is a country already steeped in gun violence, but it is certainly not unreasonable to conclude that if most European countries can get by without and armed population, what ever reason the US can’t is a solvable problem
Nope. I know about 5 liberals that don’t want guns at all. The rest are more of the ‘sensible gun laws are good’ and/or gun owners themselves.
Regarding your roommates stance – The problem with the no guns thing is this:
But:
Guns are a self defense equalizer for those who may be physically or numerically outmatched and for the non elite that do not have police at their beck and call.
——-
Also – I maintain a ranch in Texas and every year we have coyotes or even just packs of wild dogs kill some livestock. That’s even with fences and what not. We use guns to cull predators.
If she thinks that never happens – I’d say she’s privileged to only have to think about getting food from the super market.
It’s extremely rare to find liberals or democrats who think nobody should have a gun ever. Your roommate has a very fringe view on this.
I’d say the “average” Democrat probably thinks that we should pass additional gun control legislation to make it harder for kids and criminals to get their hands on guns, and probably to ban certain types of guns, although there will be massive variance in the specifics of these positions. But most of us think that if a law abiding citizen thinks they need a gun, they should be able to go fill out the papers, have a background check to ensure they’re not a violent criminal, wait a few days to make sure they have a chance to cool down if this purchase is a reflexive response to someone cutting in front of them in line at the supermarket, and then bring home a shiny new piece.
I’m a leftist and I definitely think some people need guns; i.e. minority groups when they’re about to get lynched or assaulted in public. Communists take it a level further and think the working class needs to be armed.
I don’t think most liberals- or really that many Americans overall- are truly fully anti-gun. I’m still in favor of background checks. I also wish conservatives would put their money where they mouth is when they blame “mental health” for shootings and actually widely fund mental healthcare.
SOME people will always think anything. But I’ve never known anyone on the left who thinks no one needs a gun.
Where are people coming up with this idea that liberals want to take away all guns? Of course there are fringe people who believe this, but it’s not the overall opinion of liberals.
I think it’s pretty rare. Canada has good gun control but still pretty wide gun ownership as a good barometer here. That said her hunting viewpoint is pretty fat off. Many areas hunting is heavily leaned on for population control as otherwise animals like deer would overtake large forests and destroy them. That said, strong gun control is definitely pretty broadly agreed on.
I would be totally happy with heavily regulating guns. Similar to Germany and the UK (and most of Europe really). If you really want one, for hunting or sport shooting, fine. There should be a way to do so. But the casual attitude we all have towards them in the US is insane.
I suspect this is a common theme on the left. What I consider totally acceptable, would be seen as a tyrannical government takeover by people who have made “gun owner” into their whole identity.
I really don’t understand the new “liberal” mindset towards firearms and the 2nd amendment being good. Maybe it’s just this subreddit, idk. Can someone explain it to me?
I don’t like guns, and never will, because their only purpose is to kill other people. However, my home is well stocked, locked and loaded.
I dont want guns, but go ahead if you do
At this moment in history, I feel more affinity with the second amendment than I have in the past. If someone organized an open carry protest, I’d probably attend.
There are people with all views under the sun
Better you use a scientific poll to ascertain your question rather than ask it here, unless you are simply curious of those who respond on this Sub-Reddit, how many are “pro 2A” — even then, the question is ill-defined because there are different understandings of what that means.
I’ve never voted anything but Dem and I’m basically a 2A absolutist at this point. I’d settle for a handful of administrative changes to keep guns away from those convicted of violent crimes, but that’s about it.
Guessing not popular at all. And this is one thing I wish more progressives (outside reddit) were vocal about: owning guns and using them responsibly shouldn’t be a partisan issue.
I’m all for gun control laws; I think they rarely infringe on 2A rights to the degree that more extreme 2A supporters do, but there has to be some sort of regulatory framework. I also don’t think we should block CDC research into gun violence and gun deaths. Burying our heads in the sand will never lead to sound policy, which is what we need.
There are a lot on the “left” that would like to see guns regulated analogous to the way the right wants abortion regulated: put behind arbitrary barriers designed to make them harder to access, if not outright banned in some ways.
It’s good for the country that most of them are very far away from being in charge of policy.
Edit: If you had any doubt otherwise, see the poster who said state wildlife departments don’t know how to do wildlife management: https://old.reddit.com/r/AskALiberal/comments/1jq1r0u/do_some_on_the_left_still_think_no_one_needs_guns/ml4id0w/
We don’t want your freaking guns, however NO ONE needs a semi or fully automatic weapon
What idiots think you need a gun? Your roommate is right. Nowhere else in developed countries is gun violence an issue to our levels. The reason is because there are no guns in those places. The issues are the guns.
Automatic assault rifle ban
Since when do you “need” something for it to be considered a right?
When someone has never glimpsed outside their safe cocoon, their worldview will be naïve.
Hopefully she never has to experience life without the illusion of complete safety.
While the USA does have a gun problem, disarming the law-abiding civilian population is not the solution.
But I guess since drugs are illegal that no one dies from drugs.
And good luck with the supermarket until you don’t have one.
(Complete consumer dependence is also why any collapse to an industrial population will be devastating. Covid was a sneakpeak.)
Some probably do think that yeah. There’s 340 million people in this country.