My teen (13m) has a hard time getting to the bus on time, basically every day. If he misses the bus, it takes me about half an hour out of my morning to drive him to school.
I liken it to two different kinds of toy trains. One moves on its own. One you have to push the whole way.
He’s the second kind.
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He has a loud alarm, set to go off over an hour before the bus comes… He sleeps through it. I manually wake him up multiple times every morning.
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Edited for clarity: He falls asleep later than I would like (in bed, but not falling asleep), which adds to the morning wake up problem. (He’s still getting 7ish hours of sleep most nights, which isn’t terrible, but at least an hour below what is recommended and particularly concerning because he has such a hard time getting up). No screens in his room.
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He usually has ~30 minutes to get ready by the time he actually gets out of bed. He showers at night.
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While getting himself ready (brush hair, deodorant, teeth, clothes, etc), there’s no sense of urgency, even with repeated promptings of “three minutes till we need to leave!).” It feels very passive aggressive, but I may be reading into that.
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He has a younger brother who generally gets himself ready with 15 minutes to spare during the same period, so I don’t think it’s a matter of not having enough time, necessarily.
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He does have an ADHD diagnosis, and lots of fun executive functioning challenges to go with that. I’ve tried to help him with a variety of different structural supports like checklists of things to do, automated lights that change colors based on how much time he has left, etc. he kind of ignores all of those. We are a neurodivergent household, so we are not unfamiliar with the challenges that go along with this diagnosis.
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His reaction to all of this is generally to blame me for a variety of things like not waking him up early enough. One of the most frustrating things to me about this whole deal is his lack of taking responsibility for his own actions.
All that to say, after a few weeks of me spending about triple my normal energy trying to “push” him the entire way to the bus, I told him that I would start charging him $5 if I had to drive him to school because we missed the bus. (This amount seemed like enough to create a “pain point,” but not enough to be overly punitive.)
The first day he owed me $5. The second day, he got his act together and got to the bus on time. (I saw genuine effort. Yay!) The third day he owed me $5 again.
Now he is irate and is sure that if he tells some adults about this, they will consider it wildly inappropriate. I’m certainly open to feedback, but from my perspective, I would much rather him learn to take responsibility for himself when he’s 13 and lose $5 than when he’s 23 and lose a job.
Anyway, AITAH?
Comments
I stopped at the going to bed later than I’d like. Who’s in charge here?
Yes, unless you give that money back to him at a later date (not too much later) after the habit is hopefully created, which may not be the case since they have adhd.
Let’s start with he’s getting 7 hours of sleep. That’s simply not enough. Maybe you should deal with that first. Then get yourself an airhorn. It worked for getting our 4 kids out of bed in the morning. Only had to use it a few times.
Seems fine to me. NTA
YTA. Take your kid to the doctor- I had undiagnosed adhd and struggled with this for years until I got on the right medication. Comparing him to his brother isn’t helpful either.
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YTA. Kid is 13 he still deserves a parent to parent. Even aside all the other neurodivergent yada yada yada stuff 13-year-olds are barely old enough to think as rationally as you expect.
take all of that energy that you were pouring into trying to teach him to take care of himself and just love him and parent him and let him learn by example.
NTA. Maybe showering in the morning would help rather than at night. A night shower can increase body temperature and make it hard to sleep. Even more so if you keep your house a little warmer.
On the flip side, a morning shower could help someone wake up more and be more present in morning activities. Try this.
One of the things I was told with a child starting high school was to make them get themselves up and ready for school. Let them pack their own bags etc. And let them face the consequences if they screw things up, e.g. don’t take their sports kit to school if they forget it more than once. If possible, make him take a service bus, and pay for it, and then have to do the walk of lateness at school.
Following.
My 14 year old niece refuses to get up to take the bus. Her brother is up and ready on time to take the same bus with. My sister tries but she has a torn rotator cuff and 2 toddlers. So my sister ends up having to load up 4 kids to take her to school.
I was going to make a post asking for ideas on how to get her to take the bus.
My brothers used to take my blankets. It got me out of bed…😆
YTA. Maybe pay him 5 bucks when he rides his bike?
Your expectations are way too high, IMO, especially with him getting a limited amount of sleep (kids need way more sleep than adults) and with his ADHD diagnosis.
I was your kid all the way through high school. Turns out I’m a night person & was apparently “born that way”. I was lucky to have a dad or a neighbor to drive me to high school.
I get it that you’re stressed but it does seem like your expectations of him are unreasonable.
As long as he has a free option, this seems reasonable to me, though it depends on how he gets the money. If he has no money other like the 50 bucks he gets a year from grandma 5 dollars means a lot more than if he has an allowance or job.
NTA. He’s gonna have to learn at one point or another how to be able to set at least a basic schedule so he can be on time for things. And it’s not as though this five dollar punishment is some horrific thing.
NTA.
He needs to get to sleep sooner. Takes to long to fall asleep – goes to bed an hour earlier. Simple. Or, see a doctor about possible meds.
Won’t get up in the morning?
Neurodivergence commonly involves melatonin deficiencies. Perhaps you can use melatonin to retrain his circadian rhythm into an earlier sleep time.
My son with ADHD (11) is completely unable to fall asleep before midnight without a melatonin supplement, even though he wakes up at 6:30 a.m. everyday, and even though screens turn off at 8:30 p.m. With the guidance of his pediatrician and his psychiatrist, he now takes a large dose of melatonin, 3 mg, every night around 8:00 p.m. so that he can fall asleep before 10:00. His medical providers feel that he just doesn’t produce enough melatonin naturally so a supplement is needed for him to have healthy sleep pattern.
A 13 year old should be getting 8-10 hours sleep a night so it’s not surprising he can’t get up in the morning
YTA – you are the parent. it is on YOU to teach your ADHA child how to function properly.
since you’re struggling so badly, talk to a therapist/doctor to get the sleep issue under control
Make sure it’s “lights out” at a time you specify, not him. Also make sure he has no phone, tablet, PC, or gaming system in his own room at night (require that his personal devices get charged in a common area like the kitchen).
If his starting to sleep more (getting at least 8 hours) still doesn’t work on its own, then back up his wakeup time by 15 minutes. You’re the parent and have control here! Don’t forget it!
Talk to your doctor about melatonin. My ADHD child has a hard time falling asleep and it really helped.
What you’re describing is all literally ADHD symptoms of executive functioning. With ADHD it can be pretty much impossible to just ‘form habits’ and get into routines, no matter how many lists or charts or alarms you set. That is the whole point.
Especially at age 13, it can be a nightmare. Even a neurotypical teen can struggle with getting ready in the morning.
Just because his sibling can get ready doesn’t mean your 13 year old is being passive aggressive or doing this stuff on purpose to mess with you or make your life difficult. He is likely just really struggling.
I’m AuDHD, a parent, and also have to get my kids (both AuDHD) organised in the mornings. One of mine is a lot more self sufficient and makes their own lists and keeps track of their own stuff most of the time, but the other one needs to be woken multiple times, sleeps through all alarms they set, needs to be physically shaken to get out of bed and I still have to help them find clothes and they can never find their own shoes – at age 16. And none of that is malicious, it’s just how their brain works. (Also editing to add here that in my 40s I still struggle greatly with mornings and my sleep routine has been awful my whole life no matter what I try to do – most of us with ADHD and/or ASD just don’t make enough melatonin naturally and have unusual circadian rhythms, so are usually more nocturnal, especially since the night time is a lot less sensory overwhelming.)
And school is/was also a really tough place to be going to which would make school mornings a lot harder, too.
So I don’t think YTA because I’m sure you’re exhausted and running out of ideas to get him to get organised, I don’t think the $5 thing is going to help, either. You’re likely to just scare him and have him think you’re mad at him constantly and rejection sensitivity can be a huge de-motivator as well. People with ADHD tend to get told they are doing the wrong thing and get negative comments so often that it takes a toll mentally and emotionally.
School needs PM session options , for both kids and parents .
30 min out of your day to take your own kid to school? It’s a privilege to have the time with your child in the car and to be able to take him to school. I was heartbroken my son wanted to ride the bus this school year. If he misses, it’s my responsibility to get him to school. It’s not a chore. You’re telling your son he is a burden and needs to pay you for inconveniencing you. That’s sad.
NTA – the correct answer is let him wake himself up and get to school. If he misses his bus/school it’s on him.
You’re giving him too many options and ways out and he’s not learning responsibility. When he’s an adult and has to get himself to work his boss won’t give him options. Either he’s there on time or not.
NTA. I raised an ADHD child. I understand the struggle. There is not a thing wrong with using a money motivation if that’s the thing that works for him.
I am more concerned about his “not responsible for his actions” attitude because that can grow into a very big problem. When my kid hit that stage he was a bit younger than yours, so you may need to adjust to make this more age-appropriate. But I made everything about action -> natural, organic consequence.
For example, if he failed to do a chore because blah, blah, blah… I would simply nod my head, sigh, and do the chore. Then later, say when it was time to give him a ride, I would go relax on the couch. He would come find me, all hot and bothered because I wasn’t ready yet. I would sigh, and tell him I am sooooo tired from doing extra chores that I simply didn’t have any more energy left. He would have to miss this one time.
Didn’t take long for that sequence of events to click in his brain.
In general, though, my actions (punishment, irritation) wouldn’t push him into being responsible. He had to experience the natural fallout of being irresponsible (meaning no one will be picking up his slack) to understand.
NTA. Sounds like it may be an effective plan to get the kid on the bus!
Might be worth having a sleep study done. I have sleep apnea, which was negatively impacting the quality of my sleep. I found getting up got a lot easier after getting a cpap machine. If that or something similar is going on, it could be a contributing factor.
NAH. You are doing the best you can but as the parent of a very ADHD kid who is now an adult this won’t work for him. This isn’t teaching him anything about how to handle this himself. What does he say when you talk to him about this (NOT in the morning)?
ADHD kids usually feel bad about their failings and feel like they’re failing all the time and disappointing everyone because they literally cannot do what is being expected when it’s being expected. That’s the point of the diagnosis. Also kids with ADHD are years behind other kids emotionally and with maturity. I’d factor that into your expectations. Just because it’s this bad now doesn’t mean it always will be.
A lot of the advice you’re being given here would work for a nonADHD kid but for him it just isn’t. I’d talk to a doctor about how to work on getting him to sleep sooner as you’ve done all you can with what you have. Have him get prepared as much as possible the night before. I say try showering in the morning to wake him up. You’re likely going to have to micromanage him the night prior and the morning of and only give him one task at a time to do. Eventually it will get better.
My daughter is 10.5 and very similar. Right down to ADHD, executive functioning issues, and moving like an unconcerned turtle in the morning.
She has trouble falling asleep and we recently started her on a very low dose of melatonin. That seems to really help her fall asleep sooner. It may help your son. Just consult his Dr and start small. Don’t want a melatonin hangover in the morning.
If he is on adhd meds, they’re completely worn off by the morning. Giving them too him immediately upon getting out of bed may help his focus. Some work as fast 30 mins, with a small bit immediately released.
Have you tried a positive motivator? If you make the bus this morning, you can do/have this reward after school. Or if you make the bus all week you can get this on the weekend. He may move faster with a positive motivator in his mind.
Charging $5 sounds like a punishment not a consequence. If you actually want him to learn, then the consequence needs to fit. Why not say “however late you are today is how much earlier you’ll get up tomorrow. That way he’s learning if he doesn’t have enough time to get ready he needs to give himself additional time but not by being late.
He’s 13. I mean if you want to alienate him when you get older by all means
ADHD is a disability and it sucks. NAH.
People with ADHD have troubles getting in bed on time! ADHD still exists at night. Address it with his doctor. He needs to sleep well and wake up at least 30 minutes earlier than he atually needs to get ready because he gets distracted.
Prepare all food and clothes and other things in the evening.
Can he use bicycle to get to school?
I’m sure everyone here will give you a lot of nuanced, thoughtful advice so I’ll cut to the chase. Yes you are TAH.
I love the idea of sending him to bed earlier, it might take him time to wind down, so send him to bed early if he misses the bus. Turn off the internet at bed time or have his phone/eletronics charging next to yours when he “goes to bed”. I wake up at 4 am and get on my phone till 7, then wonder why I’m getting up at 10! I love the airhorn idea too, also the packed and ready to go the night before, 👍 including knowing what to wear the night before, especially with girls to be sure your not having the those shorts/skirts and footware are appropriate for school/ weather, but yeah charge him. If any adults feel like you’re a bad mom, ask them what time you should drop your kid off at their house so they could deal with him. As parents we have the unspoken duty of raising individuals that others would want as a spouse, an employee, and a neighbor. That’s a tall order !
Instead a huge number of us are raising individuals who grab guns and go shooting school children, individuals who can’t cook, balance a checkbook, or know how to have a conversation. Don’t wait for the government to do something PLEASE!
NTA. You are a frustrated parent.
I am so thankful that my three children, two with ADHD were early risers and made it on their own 90% of the time to their early bus. There bus stops were 1/2-1 mile from the house. Occasionally I had to drive them to the bus stops. Their schools were 15-25 miles away. Driving them to school simply was not an option, I had to get to work in the opposite direction.
Can you work with his doctors to help him get to sleep earlier?
What are the consequences at school if he does not show up? Short and long term?
He is 13, it is reasonable for him to be responsible for getting up and out the door on time. By giving him a ride you are taking over the responsibility. Put it fully back on him.
How far away is the school? How long would it take for him to get there walking, by bus, or public transportation? Make it his job to figure out.
It will be a rough couple weeks. Make sure you loop in his teachers and the school administration.
Yes
Yta he’s 13. Are you serious? Take him to a doctor and maybe a therapist. And take yourself to a therapist.
Where did his sleeping habits come from?
As soon as his alarm goes off, you walk into his room, and if he’s not up, dump water on him and his bed. He will get up.
Get him a smart watch with a series of alarms for each activity.
YTA bc you are using your failure to discipline your child as the parent, as a way to punish the kid and take his money.
NTA. He needs to learn somehow. And so long as he has a way to earn that money it’s all good. I’d go further and take him to the gas station to buy you $5 of gas each time.
Also, is all technology out of his room and hands after 9pm? That could help if it’s not.
does he have a tv, a radio,acell phone? Im old but back in the early 70s i had a black and white tv
Always overslept, Always late for school.
Worked 45 years and had a clock for wake up.
when i had cell phone, I would also set alarm but placed it where i had to get up. Always got up in time.
All electronics are a stimulus
Make sure youre not letting him have things that keep him awake.
Hood luck
I taught 7th grade for years. This isn’t inappropriate at all. Others parents made their kids walk who did similarly (3-4 miles). They would get to school very late but it helped fix the issue.
He has to learn to wake up at the alarm. I dumped a 23 year old years ago whose mother would call and wake him up daily. She was making him get up and go flush a toilet so she could hear he was out of the bed. You don’t want that being your child it was pathetic.
I would see if there are things you can do to help him sleep easier. Maybe a noise machine, blackout curtains, sleep mask, weighted blanket, melatonin? Any of those things might help him fall asleep easier and then get up easier.
“it’s a world of clocks and calendars. get used to it.”
-best advice i got in school
30 minutes out of your morning? Oh how horrible.
YTA, instead of helping your child you are punishing him. Figure out why he isn’t going to bed on time. I have ADHD and getting out of bed has always been a struggle of mine. It took until university to figure it out. Its not that hard to walk in there when his alarm goes off and help him.
I’m not even going to read the comments of people who don’t understand highly neurodivergent kids.
Talk to your Kids provider about both trying out a different medication approach that could help with this (there are meds you take at night partly to help with this half of the problem) and there are executive function coaches, counselors that specialize in these sorts of things, and other”mental health” practitioners who can specifically help you explore a wider range of options than you have in order to set himself up for success when he is older and does not have anyone to wake him up.
It sounds like your child has the condition known as “teenager”
Were you one? They are more nocturnal, and have a harder time in the mornings.
Wildly inappropriate?
My parents always made me solve my own issues.
If I got up too late, it was my own responsibility to get to school in time.
I cycled, hitch-hiked or took public transport.
Learnt a lot that way!
But also learnt that the consequences for being 5 minutes late were the same as for being 1h59 late…! 😉
I was a chronically late kid. Lots of things factored into my lateness, but one of the biggest issues was not enough sleep. As others have mentioned, 7 hours is not enough for a teenager. They need more like 9-9.5 hrs according to John Hopkins. Teenagers also have a naturally shifted circadian rhythm so going to sleep early and waking up early is a bit tougher for them. Unfortunately, just because it’s tough doesn’t mean the world won’t make him get up early though. Definitely push him to get more sleep. He might have FOMO if his friends are still up and chatting, but take away his phone at night if necessary imo.
Whatever you do, don’t accuse him of purposely making things hard for you, because at least for me, that was never it, and if my mom said that I just felt terrible. I just struggled to balance sleep, school/homework, extracurriculars, and my FOMO if i went to sleep early, and hobbies. It’s a life skill I had a hard time learning.
As for him not rushing even when he’s running out of time, it could be related to his ADHD. Time blindness and all. Maybe help him time how long his morning routine takes with no rushing, so he has clear evidence that even if he THINKS it will only take 30 mins, reality is that it takes 45 mins.
You’re in the absolute right in here
When you started charging him a miracle happened: he got is act together. So this doesn’t depend on his ADHD; but much more but about his motivation. Of course he’s going to be irate about it! he’s not a 5 year old that you have to wake up, he has alarms, he is 13 and it’s your duty to teach him responsibility, and part of that, is making him responsible for his actions
I’ve seen many comments saying that he’s not getting enough sleep. Well, it happens that normal sleep cycles vary on the person and the normal ones are 4 to 24 hours. So maybe your son doesn’t even need 7. What you can do to find out is taking him to a sleep specialist and he would sure give you some indications to help your child
Now, please keep charging him the $5 bucks. Of course he’s not going to be happy about it, but this is making him have consequences for his actions, not a prize
NAH. I also have ADHD (though I didn’t find out till a couple of years ago) and always struggled with getting up in the morning. The only thing that worked for me was setting my alarm on my phone and then putting my phone somewhere far enough from the bed that I would have to physically get up and out of bed in order to turn it off. Then because I was out of bed 90% of the battle was won.
Just make sure there’s not a lot of physical obstacles between the bed and the alarm. I would leap out of bed on instinct to run and turn the evil alarm off and I would trip over stuff if it was in my way, lol.
Ideally he should be getting more sleep but once you hit teen years it biologically becomes more difficult to fall asleep before 11-12 at night, even if you’re incredibly tired. There’s legitimate science behind it that can be looked up. But that doesn’t mean there’s nothing that can be done to help. Trying to set up a decent wind-down routine where you don’t use screens, use dimmer lighting, that kind of thing. Melatonin has also been shown to be especially effective in people with ADHD, maybe something to discuss with his doctor?
I don’t think you’ve done anything wrong here, and aside from his tantrum at your creative punishment, I don’t think your son has either. He’s not being a brat, he’s fighting his body and brain every step of the way. It’s tough. But I’m not sure how effective this fining system will be long term. I suppose time will tell 🙂
Good luck!
This was my child through and through. I approached it similarly, without full considering what he was experiencing. I tried to teach him different approaches and give prompts and reminders which I’m sure only came off as nagging – it had the opposite effect for him.
Your kiddo is still very young; while “normal” 13 year olds may be able to tackle more things independently, your kiddo sounds like he’s still in need of close support…guidance, nurturing, understanding. Try to work with him. Let him come up with solutions, and brainstorm when/if his solutions don’t work. Let him lead while still laying out the expectations and holding him accountable. It will get better, but you’ve got to have some grace.
There were times that when I missed the bus I had to walk. It was about 1.5 miles. I live in Texas. So I got there late, tired and sweaty. I didn’t miss the bus very often. You’re teaching your son consequences for actions, something too few parents do now. NTA. Good parenting.
I(F) was diagnosed with ADHD when I was 8, I had similar issues your kid has. However, my family made me figure it out myself. Your child already has an advantage over me because he has a parent wanting to help. ADHD affects everyone differently, but maybe something I learned will help:
And lastly, I would say don’t make him feel ostracized or punished because he struggles differently from everyone else. HOWEVER, he does need to start learning to take accountability. My ADHD is pretty severe, but I am still aware of my actions, tone, and responsibilities. It’s not a good habit to start doing whatever you want to do, school and workforce won’t care about his ADHD. It is a lot harder to get through this, but it needs to be learned. It’s important to communicate with him so he can tell you his specific needs
There are only 3 ways to pay for a ride: gas, grass, or ass. He is paying with gas. No reasonable adult would consider this wildly inappropriate.
If you don’t give him consequences for his missteps, life will.
YTA
Let him walk to school.
NTA but you’re “fighting” against his executive functioning challenges. My nephew has those (in addition to other issues) and the same kind of behavior. You can’t be subtle about getting him to move his ass and consequences if he doesn’t. My nephew is in his early 20’s and struggles a lot with this – struggles to even keep a job for more than a few months.
You’re probably aware of much of this, but you have to work at establishing the routines and making him stick to them. The $5 is just one part but maybe enough of a push/punishment that he realizes he has to get ready faster or wake up earlier. He’s irate? Good. Maybe that’s in incentive to get up and get moving.
All I can say is that at 13 you’ve got some time but have to work the process and structure now so that hopefully he can deal with life when he becomes an adult.
Yes. You would be the asshole. Basically everything you said is common in people who struggle with ADHD. You charging him money because hes disabled is wild and cruel.
Restrict his screen time more and more each time he’s late
A few times lately I’ve seen references to this theory that teenagers being up late and sleeping late was an evolutionary thing. Societies that had built in protection at night tended to survive longer. So this could be a remnant from when humans needed someone to keep watch at night.
So, do I think you are an asshole for charging your son? No, but I do think you need to look at a different approach. This sounds like something your son may not be in control of. Help him better manage his sleep. Try melatonin at night to help establish a better sleep pattern.
NTA. I’m on the spectrum but I was getting myself up and ready by middle school. My sisters and I handled breakfast as well as catching the bus. We just needed Dad to distribute lunch money. It was very, very rare that we missed a bus.