I mean very few seem to have any real problems with women being more masculine
So why is it considered wrong for men to be more feminine and seen a failure of a man?
“Men should be Manly” see that in a lot of places when a man decides to enjoy a hobby most would see as “girly” people tend to rant about how this is the downfall of society
So why is this the case?
*Prepares to be devoted and ranted at* (Not really, maybe yea)
Comments
Define feminine men please.
You hang around with shitty people. Stop that.
Toxic masculinity. Because a lot of men don’t know how to express their masculinity in positive ways – honor, kindness, protection, being fathers to their own children – they think every other man should be just like them. And obsessing over how other people look and act is just insecurity about one’s own manhood, that their own gender or their own sexuality will be somehow compromised or put into question by proximity to or acceptance of non-gender-conforming people, including nonbinary people and trans people
Other men are uncomfortable in their masculinity and feminine men are an easy target to “prove their manliness”
I don’t subscribe to the stereotypes of gender roles and norms and I try and surround myself with people who feel the same.
It’s all related to society and the restrictions that most religions have in place. In my experience (my town for example) when guys go overboard on the camp and ramp it up to what the societal restrictions have said are unacceptable than people get uncomfortable. That’s why so many glitter guys stayed in the shadows in the past. Society and religion and the restrictions the churches insisted upon so they wouldn’t be uncomfortable. I wish it was different, but it never will be and believe me any of the gay gals that appear even slightly masculine are hounded and put down constantly.
Society is sexist and full of double standards, it is how it is. Good luck getting any empathy when complaining about a double standard that is unfair to men. Men are privileged so they are not allowed to complain, didn’t you know?
Honey you just need to move to an urban area & work at the Nordstrom Mac counter or something. Everyone will EAT UP that femininity.
In patriarchal societies, male is the superior state of being. Female is inherently inferior. So, a woman being more masculine is more acceptable because she is, in a way, elevating her state of being. Even if that does come with some drawbacks like being less sexually desirable to some men. A man being more feminine is less acceptable because he is, in a way, lowering his state of being. Denigrating himself. There are no pros for him in that situation.
It’s why it is mainly other men shaming men for being too feminine. There are women that shame feminine men too but they are far, far less common than men who do it.
The destruction of patriarchy in favor of a truly egalitarian society would be more beneficial in most every metic for both men and women.
This might be an issue with where you live or who you hang out with.
I know exactly what you’re talking about, I had a similar problem with where I grew up, where any kind of perceived feminity was bad. Weirdly enough, it was like that for women too. Of course, it was never surprising if a girl acted girly, but an “outdoorsy” “tough” girl was always appreciated.
My take away from the whole experience was, feminity is something that was OK to talk down to, to treat like a child who needs to be guided. If a women acts feminine, that’s to be expected and you’re allowed to “guide the child” in a helpful way (like teaching them about a subject you feel like you know well, or do a manual task for them so they don’t hurt themselves). If a man acts feminine, you are expected to “guide the child” in a way you would punish a child for misbehaving (harassment, getting told to “grow up”)
I haven’t lived in that town for a while, and things are much easier, socially
A manly man is seen as a provider, strong and stoic. Someone any woman would be proud to be in a relationship with, and obviously the perfect husband.
A feminine man is seen as none of those things, and probably needs taking care of by a strong and stoic woman
Why is humanity even bothering itself with such concepts at all? There is nothing less important in your life than how some dude dresses or speaks.
“Society: ‘Be yourself.’ Also society: ‘But not that kind of yourself.’”
more “masculine” girl/women do get a lot of shit from women if its their character or style, the abusers just mind their public image while doing it so you dont see much of that as an outside observer, and from men if it its their tits or lack thereof that makes them “masculine”.
for men its basic group dynamic i-am-a-better-mate-than-you rankfinding and sometimes homophobia or envy from men. some women think they will be as moody and unreliable as they themselfes (those specifically, not all women) are and think thats unattractive.
i guess the main difference would be, that its deemed more acceptable to openly abuse men then it is to abuse women and the ammount of men insecure enough for having to preemptively distance themselfes from everything they think the group sees as not attractive is a lot smaller than the ammount of women who behave like that
They’re seen as less useful. Which is, in society’s view, what determines a man’s value.
I mean your post doesn’t really give me anything to go off of. If you mean physical looks then I am not sure where you are getting your info but I hear those guys do fine or even well. If you mean certain personality traits then I would say a lot of the traits are either over exaggerated by the current culture or are things that are just better than the alternative. For example being decisive could be seen as more masculine than being indecisive but at the end of the day that is not masculine or feminine but instead it is just easier to be with someone knows what they want. It makes decision making a lot easier.
It’s not that I dislike feminine men, I get along with them and have plenty of more feminine male friends.
But, as a woman who works in a blue collar field, I can handle myself pretty well. Eventhough my body isn’t very strong, I still handle all my own responsibilities and I’ll attempt to fix something or do it myself before hiring someone else to. When it comes to relationships, women tend to carry alot of mental load and are independent in completing their responsibilities when they need to be done.
Having a “manly” man around, makes us feel like we can let loose a bit more. We take good care of our men because we know they would take care of us back. I would have a hard time being in relationship with a more feminine man, because I’d be picking up the slack on masculine duties and I wouldn’t have time to be feminine my self. it tends to build resentment when it feels like you are the only one taking responsibility in day to day life.
Safety is also a big factor for me. I am pretty small and not very strong and I feel safe with my large strong man. I know that if someone were to do something, or if I got hurt, he’d be at my side as soon as he can and he’d keep me safe in situations where I can’t handle myself. I have been in relationships with more feminine men and there is always that thought in the back of my mind where If I were to end up in an unsafe situation, he would not be able to protect me, and I would try my best to protect him. It’s hard to fully open up to a person when you can’t put your full trust into someone’s abilities.
but that’s just my thoughts on it. I like things to be pretty even where we both take care of eachother. But with feminine boyfriends I’ve had in the past, I had to take care of them more than they ever helped me.
Because people are hypocrites. They’ll tell you you can be whatever you want – as long as it’s what they approve of. I’ve seen this behaviour on all sides, right wing family value men that suck dick in the shadows, to left wingers that espouse freedoms, but will ridicule any non-traditional man for not being a “real man”.
It partly traces back to the rejection of European aristocracy. A lot of what is now considered feminine in men used to just be indicators of wealth and privilege in Europe: makeup, high heels, soft hands, elaborate hair and clothing, etc. Meanwhile a lot of what is now considered manly is related to the working class; rough, short hair, strong, simple functional clothing etc.
Because in a patriarchy, being feminine or female is seen as weakness or lesser. Think of all the times you’ve heard a guy or male teams insulted by “you throw/run/play like a girl.”
(But on the flip side, many women feel safer with gay or feminine male friends because they’re treated like peers and are less physically threatened).
For the same reason that some people can’t stand to see a Bible or Quran burned.
There is a cult of masculinity that men get indoctrinated into their whole lives. From the time they can talk, there is always some influence telling them what a man should and shouldn’t do. Even if their family tells them not to buy in, they still have to exist in a culture steeped in masculine mythology.
The world around us harshly corrects us for stepping outside the bounds of traditional masculinity, and rewards us for conforming. If you cry, you lose points. If you win in a competition, you gain points. Points for having a deeper voice, points for being strong. Points deducted for liking romcoms, sewing, or fashion. Points added for performing manual labor. Points deducted for ordering a fruity cocktail instead of a beer.
We exist our whole lives in this system that encourages and rewards us for being more masculine than the next guy, and if we know we can’t compete, we may claim to swear off the competition, but still we feel it when someone tells us we’re losing. The social consequences of a man being perceived as feminine are felt by every man at some point in our lives.
So we spend our whole lives striving for this ideal of masculinity, being both positively and negatively reinforced at every juncture. There is always a voice in our heads warning us away, telling us, “your wrist is too limp, correct it. Your shoulders look narrow, fix it. Don’t smile at the baby. Stop swinging your legs in your chair.”
When we see someone making a conscious decision not to participate in the hierarchy, it challenges our own existence in this structure. The presence of femme men who aren’t at least trying to be more masculine suggests that they don’t value the thing that is omnipresent in our lives, our peak ideal. It undermines everything we’re subconsciously working towards. Even when we choose not to engage in the rat race of masculinity, we usually portray it as being above the hierarchy, having nothing to prove because our masculinity is self-evident. Seeing someone choose to exist outside of it suggests that our highest virtue is optional.
And many respond poorly to that.
Eh, it’s just a threat perception. Masculine woman can beat you up. Feminine guy will just cry about it.
Different people have different taste in others, that’s all.
Maybe because we make great boyfriends and husbands and that makes “manly men” jealous? I enjoy “feminine” hobbies, shows, and sharing my feelings. My girlfriend loves that so much about me and she tells me that all the time. It’s a huge turn on for her and a GIGANTIC green flag. But I also enjoy working out, carpentry, the outdoors, violent shows, I’m sporting a beard right now, and I grunt whenever I cook a steak perfectly. Just do what you enjoy and don’t let the hate get to you
You wouldn’t believe it, but it’s misogyny 😬 being a woman is seen by the patriarchy (and yes, both men and women participate in that) as a lesser thing. So for a man to act like a woman, wear feminine clothes, be in a traditionally female profession, etc. is the man devaluing himself, making himself lesser and deserving of scorn.
Masculine women also get some pushback, but that’s more for encroaching on a territory they’re not deserving of. If they do prove they’re worthy, they’ve lifted themselves up and not diminished themselves, so they get some social bonuses.
Now any man who will be in a relationship with one of them will be considered as diminishing themselves because they are giving up some of their male “dominance” in a relationship, which bring him close to woman status and that’s a no no. Same with less prominently masculine gay men.
Feminine women get outward praise, for doing what they should – but in male dominated fields they also get overlooked, pushed down and dismissed a lot more than less feminine women.
For a large number of boys, a feminine man can be defined thus : “Any man who looks better and/or is kinder than me”.
I think it’s because of misogyny.
It’s fine for women to be more masculine, because masculine things are considered useful, cool and respectable by society.
But femininity is seen as weak and frivolous. Being a feminine man is irritating to people who are very dedicated to patriarchy or masculinity. It makes them feel icky to see a man choose to be feminine when he could be masculine.
I actually have always liked feminine men, so I don’t have beef with them. Some people like feminine men, and some people like femininity.
How feminine are we talking?
Like pink shirt feminine? Or “Nice guy who is willing to help, that doesn’t have an ego the size of Texas” feminine?
I’m definitely the latter, and both sexes always think I’m trying to get in bed with them. Truly ridiculous.
Because it gets associated with being gay
Toxic masculinity
True answer: misogyny.
Women being more male is seen as an upgrade.
Men being more female is seen as a downgrade.
This sexism comes from men AND women.
? I’m aroace, but some ladies love feminine men!
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/37012404/
Bro, it’s sexism and gender roles, nothing new?
I love feminine men more than anything. They are my favorite. Love em, want em, need em, all day every day.
But the answer is misogyny. Anything feminine is inferior therefore a feminine man is inferior because they are too similar to a woman, which is the worst thing you can be.
We live in a patriarchal, Misogynist society.
Rejecting femininity is tolerated to a degree because girls are meant to wish they were boys because everyone knows men are superior
Boys rejecting masculinity, on the other hand, betraying ‘superior’ masculinity for femininity are challenging the patriachal hegemony by choosing ‘inferior’ femininity
Boys are not meant to question the idea ‘masculine good, feminine bad’
To be clear, these are not my personal beliefs. I think terms like masculine and feminine exist soley to control people.
As a butch lesbian, I can say that the tolerance of masculine women only goes so far. People definitely have issues with masculine women.
That said, there is more wiggle room for women than there is for men. The weird logic is that since men are stronger / smarter / better it makes sense that women would want to be like men. A man choosing to be more like a woman is choosing to make himself worse, so there is disgust from sexist people.
Its not just about being feminine, in the US and Europe its that way currently, but really its about “successful appearing” men, men that look like they are competent, successful, good breeding material. Its just Males presenting themselves to attract and retain mates, like most mammals do and those that go around the main method get pulled down by other men and made lesser, having less value both to impress to others they are less suitable mates, thus reducing competition for the more “manly” males, or to set them apart as outsiders.
The more feminine men I know personally are all really into sport cars, all getting loud and impressive machines, or big in nerdy hobbies like card games and social games, both are interests that excite them and showcase a different vector of success then just physical macho appeal that is more mainstream.
What defines a lesser man changes over time and culture, just as what a successful man looks like. In Asian countries only 200 years ago, being overweight was incredibly attractive, showing that you weren’t just able to provide for yourself, but overprovide, now that basic food is easy to acquire. Meanwhile, being skinny in the west but fit, showing you don’t overconsume is seen as attractive.
In Europe in the 16-1700s, a lot of fashion we would call “femboy” attire today was immensely popular with nobility and upper-class society, their men dressed in high heels, wore lacey thigh high socks, skirts, had affinity for pink and light blues, dolled up faces with makeup, all these things we now call effeminate because it portrayed that they were able to not need to work hard, get dirty, or need strength, they were upperclass and thus could afford to be above it.
In Asia we still see this kind of mentality of fragile and unburdened as being attractive getting huge nowadays, the most beautiful women and men are tall, slim, with skin that is pasty white, hands that are smooth and have never seen labor. All of this is because darker tanned skin is associated with farmers, laborers, and nobility/upper class would not get those tans, those wrinkles, those worn hands. Again, that Kpop star you see millions of women fawning over, and young men look to as examples of what they need to be to attract a girl, are becoming the “Manly” desire of the east.
In the US, for the past 200 years, the nation and its culture was very much tied to hard working men, the rough and sturdy pioneer, the rugged mountain man, the hunter, the miner, the cowboy, the soldier, the sailor, people that were outdoors and needed strength and muscles to provide for their waiting woman and children. Men who could fight for their family, that had physical strength. Even as we have moved to a more indoor lifestyle, with the normal man no longer needing that rugged nature of being manly, the desire for it still echoes through the culture, and as a result more effeminate men are only recently being viewed as valuable again. We are in a transitionary period though, men no longer need to be rough, so you are seeing more and more women favoring soft and properly groomed men.
Honestly it depends on what’s considered feminine and where you live more than anything.
My personal experience: I’m bearded and heavily tattooed, but I also talk with my hands and sit with my legs crossed. I’ve got several dating app photos of me wearing sparkly eyeliner and I periodically paint my nails. On balance I think they’ve done more good than harm for my dating life, which is active. In fact the most traditional woman I dated really liked the makeup and nails, and we went out a couple times painted up.
It’s one thing to consider masculinity by the outward symbols, like beer, trucks, sports, etc. It’s another to think of inner qualities that manifest in behavior, often subtly: walking and speaking with confidence, eye contact, and how you imply sexual confidence and power through the way you move and speak. The latter, inner qualities are much more important in dating and relationships, in my experience.
It’s a gender roles thing.
If you’re out there hating on trans people, surprise! You’re also enforcing the same gender roles that keep men from expressing emotions.
Where? In some third world country or backwater?
Femininity is disliked by many, so when that trait is found on a man it’s disliked even more because a man is not “supposed” to be feminine.
Oftentimes homophobes will say “I don’t mind people being gay, just don’t shove it in my face” which basically means “you can be gay but you cannot be outwardly feminine in your behavior and style.”
Femininity is too commonly associated with weakness, co-dependence, and subservience.
Insecurity.
It’s also misogyny, as the worst men on earth generally think women are inferior to them, despite putting up with the most bullshit, including birthing their stupid asses. But, being awful people, they tend to think that’s what women are for: making more men. Therefore, they regard feminine traits as “inferior”.
Weirdly, this is in spite of the fact that feminine men used to have a big role in society in many parts of the world — albeit also due to misogyny, because of course — and were largely favored by men in power.
Personally, I’ve always had an affinity for genuinely feminine men; in addition to just enjoying femininity, there’s something very appealing to me for someone to be born and identify as male, but still be feminine.
And, well, it’s never been the feminine men that have ever tried to fucking beat or rape me, so points there, too.
Disliked by whom? Magats? Because they are small people and insecure and hate anything they are afraid of being
As a woman, I don’t hate feminine men OR gay men.
Everyone should be allowed to be themselves, regardless of gender norms.
As a femboy this post hits to the core
IDK – As a bi dude, feminine men will always hold a special place in my heart an elsewhere.
By whom?
I cut down trees, I skip and jump, I like to press wild flowers…
Me scratching my balls, “I don’t know, darling”
I don’t believe it’s a matter of feminine men being disliked, masculine men are just liked more. There’s far more “masculine” men than feminine, and people generally like to hang out with those with similar interests.
For as much as reddit likes to pretend otherwise, women generally prefer masculine men as well as they are seen as protectors and providers. So it’s just a matter of feminine men being less desirable as partners/friends in general, not a hostility thing
i think that the issue lies in the idea that you think men being more feminine is more accepted than women being more masculine. And i’d wager you think that way (erroneously) because you have not experienced being a woman that acts in a masculine way.
i work in a profession that is very much in a “woman dominated space”, and i cannot say that anyone’s treated me poorly for it, aside from being sexualized by old woman because i can do embroidery.
Because misandry is more widely accepted than misogyny.
Real men don’t have a problem with feminine men or strong women, they are secure in themselves without projecting on anybody else. They are not to confused with insecure males who have no end of problems they are incapable of managing.
I guess you can say I’m a feminine man but most girls have appreciated that I embraced my feminine side. The most manly thing you can do is not care about other people’s opinions because at the end of the day they don’t matter. Only you and the people you care about
No one think that way
Do very few people have problems with masculine women? Maybe attractive straight women who like one or two typically male interests, but don’t think more ‘butch’ lesbians get it easy. No more so than effeminate men for example.
Sexism.
Men role in society is perceived as more important than a woman’s . Women are perceived as silly , sassy , emotional, to be protected ( weak ), and should be taking care of children.
Why in hell would a man want to be weak and sassy, etc, a lesser individual? They must be pathetic.
On the other hand, that’s why women get away with dressing like men at the office , she looks strong , intelligent, confident because she acts like a man ..
It’s nothing but sexism.
Same reason mens Crocs in pink are $19.50 when any other color is $30+, but I don’t know the honest answer to why.
To be fair, masculine women aren’t really accepted either, so I think that part of your premise is flawed. Only a certain kind of extremely limited masculinity is seen as acceptable in women. They can wear pants and be tomboys when they’re young, but that’s basically the extent of acceptance for “masculine” women. Look at actual butch women and you’ll see that they’re still met with a lot of hostility.
Women have lower social status than men.
Because people are idiots and hold arbitrary standards that they inflict on others. It doesn’t extend to only feminine men, the people that are judging other men are doing the same thing to their coworkers, women and others.
It is also usually a learned behavior, handed down like a burning torch from asshole parent to asshole child. “Here son, carry this torch of hatred.”
Grow a pair Felicia
Some of them act more feminine and girly and emotional than actual women and it’s just really annoying. I watched a show once with a really feminine YouTuber dude that constantly whined and cried about everything in the most shrill high-pitched voice while fidgeting like a lunatic and it was the most obnoxious thing ever. In real life, they generally don’t take responsibility for anything, always act like some victim, and have no personality beyond being sassy and condescending. And yeah, the ultra manly men are just as annoying, too. Like the manly men, they don’t just act feminine, they dial up the gender stereotypes to 150% until they’re insufferable.
Hello, feminine man here-
I’m lucky enough to live in a very blue city, but some of my family members still hold the traditional value of masculinity. Here is what I came up with:
Essentially, masculinity is protected, meaning that you are either a masculine guy or you’re ‘gay’, which for some men, is the worse thing. Unfortunately, there hasn’t been any type of men’s movement that hasn’t been convoluted with misogyny, like there has been with women’s rights movements.
Men are still operating in the same capacity as they have been, back when working at a factory was the go-to job to raise a family. This ties back as to the working conditions men had to go through to earn a wage. Such things like back breaking labor and long hours were the norms and many men were conditioned to just ‘ignore’ their feelings of exhaustion, depression, sadness, etc. so that they can keep being exploited by their labor. How else are you supposed to unionized if you can’t express these feelings to other men?
As women kept on getting more and more rights- the idea of a woman started shifting which allowed woman to explore what it means to be a woman- even dipping their toes on what used to be deemed as traditionally masculine. This wasn’t the case for men, however.
Even without the working conditions part- media also plays a HUGE role on how culture is formed as well. Back when media became commercialized, it allowed men in suits to shift the culture in however they wanted to. You had men being stars, being the hero, saving the women, all while being stoic. Take a look at WWII propaganda. Men were supposed to “fight for the country”, give up their life for what they thought were right, and be happy about it. Notice how they’re all strong, with huge biceps, super fit, etc.
The idealized masculine man showed up in almost all the media back then which even furthered and solidified what it meant to be a ‘man’.
This idea of what a man should be, is past down from generation to generation. Even when boys are raised by their mothers, they’re still taught how to be a patriarchal man, sometimes even more than if they were raised by a father. This is because moms tend to overcompensate as they don’t know how to navigate the world as a man.
Closing statement/ personal thoughts:
I don’t know what to feel about where men are heading. I want to be optimistic about it, but with more right-wing grift men’s podcasts, I don’t know. I do know, that being a man is hard and scary right now. With more independent creators- I’m hoping that there will be positive role models boys to follow.
I also see how masculinity negatively affects men. I remember when Terry Crews was talking about being SA’d by an exec, but then a lot of men called him a ‘sissy’ for opening up. I see men being worked to the bone and showing off their money even if they work 12+ hour days.
I’m lucky enough to be slightly older (26) and still somewhat relate to the boys now. Unsupervised access to the internet is scary and can lead boys down a rabbit hole of degeneracy. I remember when I was 13-14 I was into ‘edgy humor’ and ‘owning SJW’ videos which leads down the alt-right pipeline. I’m lucky enough that it was pretty limited, but with the craziness and how big and established the internet is now, you can be trapped by the algorithm.
I would say because opposites attract 🤷🏾♂️
I’m. Or a machines but I’m not a bitch either. I like to cook, I like a clean house, do take care of my child, love female hygiene leoducts(soaps lotion ext)
But I also like sports, martial arts, cut grass, fix cars, handy, and will fight your ass if you get disrespectful….
Idk… I personally don’t want to be with a masculine woman.
This is not my experience. At least, these men are not disliked by women (as a whole, of course there’s a subgroup of self-hating women who subscribe to misogynistic thinking).
The treatment you’re talking about comes directly from other men. This is exactly what we refer to when we say that patriarchy hurts everyone. Men and women should be able to make the choices they want to make for themselves without being ridiculed. It’s patriarchy that lays the groundwork for cruelty.
Because society hates women. Society villanizes emotions which in turn villanizes women because women are the only ones with emotions right?
Who is saying this? I’ve got some effeminate male friends and they’re all well liked dudes that are doing very well in life.
You’re always going to have some people that will find reasons not to like you. You can’t please everyone.
They’re only disliked by men.
Fuck that question, the real question is that why is it wrong for women to approach men like its taboo or something. The most a “Woman” does is give you those lets fuck eyes or get really close to you and just bend over or do something visually odd that they consider sexual in nature to get your attention. any way thats the fucking question for today! Happy Monday and Assholes live forever. peace!
No hate , but I don’t like being around non masculine men
It’s an intersection of a few things.
Gender norms — anyone who is invested in gender norms for whatever reason, be it religion, political, or a simple lack of exposure to anything else is made uncomfortable by gender nonconformity. After women were allowed to wear pants, society became a little more accepting of tomboys, but the same movement didn’t meaningfully happen for men.
Homophobia. Anyone can be a feminine man and straight (hypothetically) (I’m on my hands and knees begging to find a feminine straight man) but that has a strong cultural association with being gay. People who are homophobic, and sometimes transphobic, will also express vitriol towards feminine men due to this association.
Misogyny. The reason masculine women are more acceptable than feminine men to society — at large, if they get too masculine they’re subject to similar criticisms — is because masculinity is seen as “better” than femininity. Women who are being masculine are “moving up”. Men who are being feminine are intentionally “moving down”, and a lot of people who are invested in cultural narratives like this have a compulsive desire to ‘correct’ this when they see it.
The men should be manly crowd typically hold that viewpoint for conservative political reasons, whether or not they’re consciously aware of it. When you get that critique from a woman, it’s because she’s looking for a partner that suits what society tells her to do or whatever. When you get that critique from a man, he’s trying to assert his dominance within his social group by signaling his manliness in comparison. Both would also be trying to ‘punish’ and ‘correct’ you back into following social norms.
Either way, I wish there were more feminine men in the world </3 Sigh…
Stop hanging around Republicans. Problem solved.
It depends who you ask. I personally prefer feminine men.
Most people don’t have a problem with feminine men and most do not have a problem with masculine women. Although some people have a problem with both.
If women in general wanted to fuck and marry feminine men, men would have embraced feminine traits. But they don’t. Women tend to choose men who are more masculine than they are, and also have a preference for sex with more masculine men than those they marry. Yes it varies, but there are trends that discourage wide swaths of feminine traits in men because women exclude those men from being possible partners. It is not because men find those traits inherently less valuable, but because women find men who have them to be less desirable. Women are the ones who devalue their own feminine traits when they are see them in men.
Yeah, as a woman I don’t get that either. I’m actually attracted to more feminine men, or at least men who are in touch with their feminine side and not ashamed of it.
Misogyny and homophobia
Double standards are a bitch, but I gotta ask:
Is physical strength tied to gender roles? What if you’re a very effeminate man, but you’re built “Ford Tough” (presenting as physically strong, good amount of muscle mass)?
Women keep feeding each other this idea that the man they go after should essentially be a bully, that’s why you find a lot of women in their younger years going after the douchey types and get surprised when they are left with a kid and no man 😂
I mean, I would say the people who bitch about “feminine men” also bitch about “masculine women” as well.
It’s just part of the boyosphere grifting, at least the current majority of it is.
Like, the incredibly childish notions that a “manly masculine man” will provide for his woman (not another man), care for her, and protect her, while his woman is his property and should be feminine and submissive and spend her existence supporting him and in everything he wants in return for his “money and protection.”
In other words, old-fashioned nonsense born of insecurities as well as general stupidity.
Masculine women would point out they’re not respected either, many society isn’t really ready for people to step out of gender roles.
I’m not sure this is just a problem men have and not something that bothers women. Men also feel more threatened by gay men than women do by either gay or lesbian people. It goes against their understanding of superiority complex and shows them that men and women are not that different, is my theory.
Being female has always been a disadvantage: mainly to women.
It’s just incels who have this world view though.
I love feminine men they are my fav type of men
‘Manyly’ men are ‘afraid’ that ‘girly’ men are going to fuck them, ie top them, which shows just what a facade their ‘manliness’ really is
Makes me think of that experiment, where a group of monkeys were placed in a room, with a step ladder leading up to some bananas. Any time a monkey would try to climb the ladder to get to the food, the entire group would be punished, so they stopped trying.
Then one of the monkeys was replaced with a new monkey, who, of course, would immediately try to climb the ladder. The other monkeys, not wanting to face another punishment, would tear the new monkey off the ladder until they, too, learned not to try.
This was repeated until none of the original monkeys remained, yet the group would still tear a newcomer off the ladder because that’s all they knew. Even though the punishments wouldn’t have occurred at this point, it didn’t matter. Any one monkey only knew that they themselves weren’t allowed to climb the ladder, and so no one else was allowed to climb it, either.
Women love feminine and androgynous men usually.
So I don’t know who doesn’t like them
I personally love a girly man 🤷🏻♀️
It depends what you mean by feminine.
I bake, cook and like a clean cut and to be well dressed. Some of my friends are the same.
I also work out, hike and climb.
I don’t watch any sports and would rather go to a book reading or play or board game.
Men and women can do traditional opposite gender things but still be feminine or masculine.
I love feminine men, I’m a masculine straight-seeming gay man, and my type is men who fully embrace femininity. Like they shave their body hair, use a touch of makeup, dress androgynously, full femboy types, are my type.
There are red blooded heterosexual men that are camp. It’s amusing.
In our society, being manly is the default and the “good” option. Therefore its fine for women to be more manly because its someone adopting more “desireable” traits.
On the other hand, being feminine is seen as being weak so if a man chooses to feminine, it means they are purposefully trying to be weaker and rejecting their superior natural male state.
Its bunch of nonsense but we still very much live in a sexist society with dumb rules.
They are definitely not disliked by bisexual women.
Most of the time the people I personally see hating on these kind of men are men themselves. I know some women do but I commonly see it from men
And it seems to be that way with tons of things. Women are most critiqued by other women, there are ofc lots of men who critique us but it seems like women are the majority
Idk why we seem to have the need to judge anyone at all but especially our own gender if they’re not fitting our personal ideas as to what means what