Lately my daughter has been in trouble constantly, not only with school but with the police too. She has a new friend group(before she had no friend group so she’s clinging to them desperately) and I can see right away that these kids are trouble. Am I wrong for making her give me the passcode to her phone so I can see wtf she’s actually up to? I have conflicting feelings about it but she can’t seem to be honest with me anymore so what else can I do?
Is it an invasion of privacy for a parent to go thru their 13 yo child’s phone at random? At what age does this become inappropriate?
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I would say as long as your paying for phone and they’re living with you when she gets a job and can pay, she can have privacy. But no way at 13. You’re being a good parent for wanting to be involved.
Only invasion of you live separately, pay for your own food and bills. Otherwise, no privacy is invaded. It’s like you expecting privacy in your company emails/texts/communications when you are currently employed by that same company that pays you salary.
Well if she’s a minor and she’s already having trouble that involves the police then I don’t think that’s invasion of privacy but rather “parenting”
Every parent I know with kids this age made having access to the phone, at any time, a requirement of getting said phone.
Edit: I missed the part about trouble with the police. Let’s just say, for me, that would be grounds to have the phone taken away altogether, at most they’d get one of them phones designed for small children, you know, the ones where the parents enter the phone numbers into contacts, and those are the only numbers that phone is able to call/text.
At 13, it’s not an invasion of privacy. Especially if she’s in trouble with the school and the police. It sounds like you need to do a bit more than look at her phone.
Your house your rules.
anything I pay for, I deserve access to
You have every right until they’re 18. Until then, children don’t legally own anything.
So it’s well within your parental rights to go through anything that’s legitimately concerning, especially for their protection.
However, there’s always a gentle way to go about things so they don’t think you’re just an intrusive tyrant.
Make sure they know that you love them, and are concerned about their safety and mental well being.
Not sure why people have a problem with my comment.
When they’re 16 imo. I’d certainly have regular access to my 13 yo phone.
No, you are the parent. Inappropriate after they start paying for their own phone or not in your custody anymore
YES im 21 and im saying this
Yes it is an invasion of privacy. The question might, instead, be “Is it a legal invasion of privacy?” Yes. -OR- “Is it a necessary invasion of privacy?” Your call, as the parent.”
Is it worth the sense of betrayal (due to actual betrayal) that your child will experience to gain evidence?
Hmm I’m not sure it ever becomes inappropriate. Once you become an adult it just changes to looking through your phone for something they need, instead of for your own safety. We also know all our passwords just in case.
When they turn 18 and are a responsible adult not living under my roof and by all means I don’t think it would be appropriate to go through their phone. Until that point in time, I am responsible for that person. I will go through their phone should I feel the need.
When I’m no longer paying for it.
You should have had the passwords and a monitoring app as soon as kid got the phone.
Living with me and I’m paying expenses, it’s MY phone and I let you use jt. My kids are 100% ok with it and I’ve never once looked, no reason to.
Kids living at home should have no expectation of privacy whether it be on their phone (which I pay for), in their dressers, etc. Parents can and should snoop on their developing kids. It’s how we keep them safe and out of trouble. You are betting off giving them too little privacy than too much. It’s not about trust, it’s just that people do stupid things.
I mean it’s always gonna be an invasion of privacy but like you have to decide how you want to handle this situation with her friends and how much phone access she has
It’s tricky. On one hand, keeping your daughter out of serious trouble is important. On the other hand, making the decision to remove trust in your relationship with her will absolutely cause damage for years.
Consider this: teens are resourceful. if you make your daughter give her passcode to you, she will 100% attempt to hide things. Whether or not you catch it is up to her hiding skills and your finding skills, in which case I’m putting money on her. There COULD be benefit, but I am 99% sure your daughter will see you as a “controlling and toxic” instead of “loving and caring,” and you may end up with a resentful daughter that doesn’t trust you when she does get into deep trouble.
What exactly should you do? first and foremost protect your daughter’s well-being. After all, that’s what matters at the end of the day. That being said, you need to do your ABSOLUTE best to maintain mutual trust, respect, and love. Good luck parent
I’m not a parent, so I’m sure I’m missing a lot here. I wouldn’t go through the phone without a reason to do so, but it seems like you have more than sufficient reason to think something is going on.
13 yo fuckups have no rights, they have privileges. The phone is a privilege, privacy on the phone is another privilege, and they both have to be earned. She has no right to privacy, she’s a minor and you’re the parent. It becomes inappropriate when she’s a grown ass woman you can trust to not get herself arrested for throwing rocks at cars (or shoplifting or whatever).
It becomes inappropriate at the moment the child is self sufficient in their finances and lifestyle, whatever age that may be.
18 when you’re an adult.
If you are paying for the phone, you have the right to look at it.
She’s a minor child that you are responsible for.
I recommend a child psychologist if he’s having troubles.
If your pay for it, no. It’s a luxury not a right.
Nah you have to wait till 5 stars wanted level to look through phone. FBI is not even enough. Gotta be navy seals on your property w/ stealth helicopters like in the bin laden raid before “looking at their phone” becomes a viable parenting tactic.
It’s past time for this. One run in with police at age 13 should be bye bye privacy.
And no friends is better than those friends, so that should probably stop too.
Any parent with a child under 18 is the responsible party in their child’s decisions and actions. If you are concerned that your child is involved in illegal or inappropriate activities or behaviors, it is YOUR JOB as a parent to address those issues. Searching a phone for evidence of suspicious activity is appropriate.
Kids need to be supervised regardless of how well behaved they are. Their behavior, and age, should determine the amount and type of supervision. If she’s getting into trouble with police and has suspect new friends then she wouldn’t even have her phone if she were mine. You give kids trust to a point and what’s age appropriate. When they break they trust then, they lose the right to certain privacies.
We as parents DO have a right to know who our minor children are talking to, hanging out with, and what they’re doing whether they believe we do or not. It’s how we keep them safe. It’s how we keep them from getting into too much trouble or making mistakes they’ll regret the rest of their lives. You have a right to know if, say, she’s”dating” an older boy or even an adult that she doesn’t realize is grooming her.
Go through her phone. Read all her messages. Go through all her other social media accounts too. Teens don’t usually text anymore, they use other apps and platforms. So make sure to look for those. I can’t remember the name of the one mine uses but it’s the popular one right now. A lot of gamers use it.
I think around 16 is probably time it becomes their own responsibility. But our daughter is only 12, so part of the deal is I retain access to whatever is on there, and I make full use of the Google parental controls as I deem fit.
I know she’s not an idiot, and I don’t care if she’s developing relationships with boys (or girls, whatever) – but I like to make sure she’s being safe, as with Snapchat group chats the way there and the auto save photos, I understand it’s real easy for questionable stuff to get stored on the cloud.
As long as you are paying for the phone and plan you can look through it any time you want imo as a parent.
WAY better to get flack of ‘invading privacy’ than to look back and wish you ha done soeafter something bad happens.
If you are paying the phone bill then it’s technically your phone. If you suspect your daughter is up to no good then I think it’s ok to invade their privacy but kids today are very techno say they know how to cover their tracks digitally. It’s not a guarantee that you’ll find anything.
Under normal circumstances, I’d say yes it is. But if she’s in trouble with the police, then I think it’s necessary.
Yes and no. I wouldn’t wait until she’s 18 to stop potentially checking her phone. I would try to address the root of the problem.
I used to be a substitute teacher who mostly worked with behavior and special ed students (students with behavioral problems). I’ve found that the best way to address problems is with a mindset of empathy, open mindedness, and willingness to understand– this can be a really delicate thing to do though especially with an established relationship.
I’d be concerned that looking through her phone would make her see you as an antagonist and make her less willing to open up to you which might be necessary to find the root of the problem.
The root of the problem is often a unmet need/desire, sadness, grief, or insecurity. Like, did you guys recently move, does she have a health condition, or something else? It sounds like she might’ve felt isolated and lonely and is now attaching herself to this friend group. Sometimes people get involved with the “wrong” people out of boredom, bad home life, or feeling like they don’t belong. What if you signed her up for extra curricular activities like a team sport (physical activity reduces restlessness), an event that regularly meets at the library (library attendees are often nice and nerdy), art classes (practicing creativity is the antithesis of anxiety), or something?
Maybe offer to sign her up for therapy and give her 2-3 options for therapists. If privacy is an issue then you can agree to follow HIPAA for adults.
I’ve found it helps to offer children 2 specific options with a reward for doing one of the options. Like, if you pull all the weeds from this 3 by 3 foot square part of the garden I’ll make you an ice cream sundae or you can choose not to do it. Or, do you want to help me set the table with forks and napkins (behavior kids often act behaved when asked to do a specific task). Both situations asked in an upbeat, casual way because tone can make it or break it.
Whatever you do, I would avoid putting down her friend group within earshot of her. If she heard you expressing that then she may become more defensive and that’d make it harder to get to the root of the problem (the ultimate goal).
One way to reframe a complaint is by turning it into a wish. Like, if someone complains about the dishes being dirty then it can reframed as a wish for clean dishes.
Sometimes removing privacy is necessary but it would be a last resort for me. This might not be applicable for your case, but I believe that when we treat children as irresponsible then they’re more likely to act irresponsible. It’s good to teach responsibility. It can be tricky though
Be a parent.
If I were 13, and was already in trouble with the police, I wouldn’t have HAD a phone.
Teenagers need to demonstrate that they’re responsible enough to be trusted with a phone. When they break that trust, they should be held accountable for that lack of trust, including the removal of privileges
The condition of having a phone means we as parents have access to it whenever we want.
As long as I’m paying for the phone and the service and they are a minor in my home, I have no problem checking it.
The main condition besides safety for them to get their phones was that they have to give us access at anytime we ask, immediately. No keeping the phone for a few minutes or whatever. My thumbprint is in both of their phones. I do this for safety too, if there were ever a situation where getting into their phones was needed due to an emergency or something, we can get into them right away. If they don’t give us their phone, the service is shut off, the wifi password gets changed so they cannot use it and they also lose privileges to other electronics because kids are sneaky and find a way.
With that being said, I wouldn’t look at their phones unless I had a cause for concern (which it sounds like you do). I’m all about privacy and respect but that has to be earned.
She is thirfuckinteen years old she will give you the passcode or she doesn’t get a phone. Until she is 18 she lives by your rules. After that she live by your rules or moves out.
Fair game at any point before 16, anyone younger doesn’t have anything they should be hiding.
16-18 only if there’s disciplinary issues, which there obviously is in this circumstance.
It becomes inappropriate at the point that the teenager starts paying for their own phone. My child isn’t old enough for a phone yet, but when he is, it will be my phone that he’s using. Until he can support himself. I’m not an invasive parent, I wouldn’t routinely look through his stuff, but if I had reason to (suspicions he was involved in bullying or concerns about contacting adults or stuff) then I would expect to be able to. And if he objected I’d cancel the account.
Absolutely not.
Thru??
Flip phone until you can afford your own
No invasion of privacy to be seen here.
Kids don’t have a right to privacy while living in someone else’s house and having someone else pay for their entire existence.
13 year old involved with the police? Fuck their privacy… you are at a critical stage OP, if you don’t intervene now and get that kid help soon they will lost for a long time, if not forever
I was a troubled teenager by most standards. I personally disagree, but appearance is more externally important than personal reality.
I was drinking and song drugs in my early teens. I was sneaking out at night, I was fighting, I was doing all sorts of troublesome things.
My parents weren’t bad parents. Distant, maybe, but I don’t think that was my problem. I like the thrill. I didn’t truly calm down until I had kids – and thus, responsibility.
You need to find out what the child is into, why they’re doing it (not why you assume they’re doing it). And he’ll direct it to be more productive or tech then life skills that are relevant. Drug dealing can tech about business, for instance. I’m not saying enable the child to do “bad things” but use the bad things to help them understand the world better so they take more time to consider actions before taking them.
No. Police involvement is not going to fix the problem. If it did, we wouldn’t have a big repeat offender problem. No. Counseling isn’t going to help because it’s not scratching the itch of whatever the child is doing.
I’m sorry we can’t help, but there isn’t much information to go on. And, no, consequences don’t work. You can, once again, tell by the fact that they’ve never worked before. In all of human history, consequences have never worked. You can tell because we keep doing the same shit.
Teach the child to understand the purpose of the rules so they can work with them or around them safely.
At her age and these circumstances, having full access to her phone is perfectly reasonable.
Her mind is very moldable at this age and a phone is a strong (unfiltered) connection to the rest of the world. And it seems that poor influences have already begun making their way in. But still, the way you go about this is critical.
Don’t take a combative approach like, “I can’t trust you, so I’m watching your phone.” And don’t be secretive either. Explain why you need access to her phone: “I need to know you’re safe, and I feel like you’re slipping into something dangerous. I’m not trying to control you, I’m just trying to understand and help you.”
By the time she’s maybe 16 or 17, random phone checks might be a little inappropriate. But for now I think it’s reasonable.
We made it clear, it’s not their phone it’s our phone we are providing for their use so it comes with rules.
Minors, especially in their parents’ house, do not have any expectation of privacy. You, as the parent, have full legal authority to go through their room, their belongings, their phone, etc.
That being said, you seem to be in a scenario where trust needs to be rebuilt in all directions. This is a challenging task, and you may need help. You can’t help anyone if you are not able to help yourself. Seek some sort of parent and family counseling. They can help guide you and your kids to a healthier relationship.
Edit: To be clear, if you think your daughter, or any of your kids, are involved in dangerous, risky behaviors, take the steps you need to. But counseling may help the long-term relationship.
IMO, if she is this young and also having problems with police, I’d take away her phone all together. She lost that privilege the second she got in trouble with police.
13? Not only should you have the passcode, but you should be able to ask for it at any time and have her hand it over. My daughter is 16 and she knows this.
Lots of people don’t even have phones at 13. It should be under your Apple ID and if she is getting in trouble with the police, I would snatch that thing so quick. Have you tried getting her into any new hobbies or activities? Get her to meet new friends? If she gets in trouble send her to charity with other her kids her age or something with no phone. She will be forced to make new friends while doing something good. Or a sport or something!
I wouldn’t have even asked for the password. Just set up the childs phone on your carriers account to send you transcripts. The age when it’s an invasion of privacy is when the phone is theirs and they pay for it. Until then that’s your phone.
No, at 16 or 18, depends when they start paying for it themselves
No. When I gave my daughter a phone, I specifically told her I would periodically check it, and I even did in front of her.
Just purchase the app Bark and it will relieve SO much stress. Was exactly what I needed for my daughter at that age!
If you have to ask there’s bigger problems here. My guess is your concern for her alleged privacy is a big reason you/her are in this spot.
Plus I saw this happened with your other two kids, I’m trying to figure out why you thought doing the exact same thing would work this time
Inappropriate? When you stop being the one paying for it.
If you’re paying the phone, it’s your phone. If you’re paying for the service, it’s your business to know how the service is being used.
If you own the phone id suggest putting key logging, monitoring on it. You may need to check your local laws.
Having that software on our home pc was great when the kids were 10-13. It made us aware of daughters SH and being bullied, with the boys it helped with other stuff.
We never told the kids about it. And around 15 we had stopped monitoring. The point as parental oversight is to spot any big issues and so it’s not something you should be going through everyday.
18 years old.
When they pay the bill
She is 13. She does need not need privacy online at 13. Also, you checking up on her may prevent her from behaving badly.
When you’re paying the bills it’s all fair game. You can be nice and ask, bit it’s your phone that she gets free use of.
She’s sacrificed the right to privacy. If you don’t invade her privacy now, cops and courts will; and maybe revoke her right to liberty too.
Bruh, I would invade a 30-year-old’s phone if the police was involved.
Who cares about privacy at that point?
If someone lives with you and they’re involved with the police, it’s a safety issue.
Honestly, in your position, I would homeschool, and I don’t even believe in homeschooling.
Or move to a small city in the midwest and start over, away from the bad influences.
No!. It’s responsible parenting. 13yo’s are prey, but too undeveloped to realize it. When you aren’t paying for it.
When they pay their own bills
Great question. I don’t know the cut off age but at 13yo yes, watch the phone carefully.
Not an invasion of privacy. I wasn’t afforded any semblance of privacy in 1993.
When they can either be honest, or start paying for their phone themselves is when you stop demanding to check it.
16 17 that invasion till then your a child
It becomes inappropriate at whatever age they are considered adults and are paying for their own phone. Before that you’re are primarily a parent and responsible for your child. At this age, privacy is a privilege, not a right.
18
According to your post history you: don’t know how to talk to/interact with women, are HIV positive, have substance abuse issues, want to know if it’s acceptable for you to date a 19 year old boy when you’re 39, and somehow you have 3 kids and are a single parent? This is fake, right? This is a disaster. Seriously what are you doing?
My mom stopped going through my phone when I got a girlfriend, at 17. But she also knew I was responsible enough to not do anything stupid. My sister is now also 17 but still gets her phone checked. Imo if you pay for the phone, you can go through it whenever.
It’s appropriate while they live under my roof , eating my food using the devices I bought with the services i pay.
Invasion of privacy if they moved to their own place, buy their own food and their own devices and also pay their own services.
I don’t think children under the age of 16 have any reason to have their own phone unless it’s for emergency purposes only..
It’s less about age, it’s more like she lost that privilege by doing untrustworthy things. She can earn the trust back later.
Absolutely not. My sons didn’t get phones until they were high school (14). Our rule was, if I demand to see your phone, take your phone as punishment, you hand it over no hesitation. We never had issues with my sons getting in trouble though so we never had to go through their phones. With my eldest son, once he reached 17 and his senior year, I respected his privacy. He’s an adult in college now. My youngest is still a sophomore so the rule still applies to him.
Install the Bark app!
Until they are 18 unless they are completely paying for it themselves, I see no harm just maybe frame it as something normal, maybe allow them to look through your phone or something. Don’t frame it like a punishment, be honest what you are looking for.
It only becomes an invasion of privacy one the child is both 18 and paying for their own phone.
She is your daughter. You are supposed to protect her.
>Lately my daughter has been in trouble constantly, not only with school but with the police too.
I would say that your child should have serious phone restrictions until she shows that she is capable of good judgement and emotional control. If police are involved this isn’t a ‘you’re on restriction for a month’, but rather ‘you aren’t good on your own, and we will give you the ability to run your own life when you so that you are more mature’. Note the difference – behavior, not time, is her ‘ticket to having more control over her life’ here.
>Am I wrong for making her give me the passcode to her phone so I can see wtf she’s actually up to?
Not at all. You pay for that phone. If she refuses to give the passcode, the phone is yours. Probably gets cancelled. Then, after six months of good behavior, you might decide to get her a ‘senior citizen phone’ that only makes phone calls to 10 numbers, two or three of which are close family members.
>I have conflicting feelings about it but she can’t seem to be honest with me anymore so what else can I do?
She needs to stop the bad behavior. You need to be responsible to stop the bad behavior, and part of that is physically cutting off her ability to make bad choices, just as when she was a young child, she couldn’t cross the street without holding your hand.
If my 13 year old was in trouble with the police, they wouldn’t have a phone.
Your house, your rules, and you’re paying the bill. She hasn’t earned your trust and she should be treated as such. Definitely not entitled to privacy at that age.
No it’s not an invasion of privacy. My oldest is 13 and I will go through his phone randomly until he’s 18. I know his password and I have a separate password for parental settings. From 16 onwards, I’ll probably only do it when I have suspicion to do so. If there is a real issue and your children aren’t listening to you, they don’t deserve phones. You have a right to that as well. YOU are the parent.
As long as they are a minor and I pay for their phone, it isnt invasion of privacy. It is my duty to raise the child, not let them get their way.
My kids both had to provide their passcodes or remove them when they were growing up. Failure to do so and I bricked their phone. Can’t do much without cell service or internet. Both of which I pay for.
18 is when they legally become an adult. At that point, you should probably stop going through their phones.
Edit: also put life 360 on both of your phones. This choice isnt up to your daughter. Keep control of your situation.
Trust is earned. Getting in trouble with the law breaks that trust.
Aren’t their parent controls or apps that let you remotely monitor a phone’s activity?
She’s 13. Even if she wasn’t getting into trouble, the phone is yours. You pay for it, hardly any 13 year old purchase a phone and pay for a plan on their own. If you bought it and are paying for it to be useable, it’s your phone that she’s using. If she’s getting in trouble with the police, you’d be an idiot not to be regularly checking her phone. And with all the scary shit happens to kids (she’s still a kid) with unsupervised phone / internet access, you should have her phone information and be aware of what she’s doing on there. An invasion of privacy would be installing cameras in her room, not checking through the phone that YOU bought and pay for her to use.
Go ahead and downvote me teenagers. Lol.
if she knows you can look through her phone whenever you want she isn’t going to leave evidence of anything she’s doing in her phone. if you want to inspire her to become better at keeping secrets, sure go through her phone. but odds are it’ll work once and then you’ll have burned checking the phone as a viable way to ever find out what she’s doing again, so it might be better to save that.
have you tried talking to her like a person and finding out what’s causing her to do this stuff? no one has ever built a healthy relationship with their kids on a foundation of control and mistrust. do you want to live like you have a side job as a prison guard in your own home for the next 5 years or do you want your kids to trust you?
If a person doesn’t pay for the phone themselves, they have no claim to privacy. I’m a 53 year old woman who is still on her parents’ plan and if they asked to go thru my phone they should be able to.
I have a 13 year old and they know their phone is fair game and I can check it at any time with no warning.
Thankfully I have a pretty good kid and they’re fine with this. Whenever I do have a look through, they’re generally with me so we can talk about anything I see that I feel may not be appropriate.
If my kid was in trouble with the police or involved with people i felt were shady, phones, laptops, gaming devices and going out with friends would definitely be things confiscated or put a stop to.
If you think she’s old enough to have a phone that can be locked and have sensitive information then she’s old enough to keep it private.
Massive invasion of privacy.
You should have been going through her phone regularly as soon as she got it.
There’s so much online that is actually insane to expect a kid to be able to navigate on their own.
Heads up that the first check will likely be anticipated, and potentially shady contents purged once you bring up handing over the passcode. Surprise checks will reveal the actual behavior.
Privacy is important to me, but it’s my responsibility to parent.
I think the key thing is communication. We’ve always said what is private and what is not. Their personal diary, their room with the door closed etc is private. We won’t ever look in there.
Their electronic devices are not private – they shouldn’t be doing anything with it they don’t want us to see.
Nope. The only people who are going to tell you “no” or super crazy liberals and teens posting on here.
Your title is inconsistent with the body of your post.
Going through your child’s property at random (including phone) is not appropriate at any age, as long as it’d done without consent and child is old enough to understand the concept of “privacy”.
If you suspect actual problem, so it’s not just “random check”, then you as parent can demand access to specific applications which you ideally look through in the child’s presence. This is appropriate as long as child is still a minor. Of course, older the child, more serious the problem must be to warrant this invasion of privacy.
You have a responsibility to monitor your child’s internet activity. It’s a dangerous place. It’s inappropriate to believe that you’re invading their privacy when you’re keeping them safe. I can’t tell you how many times irresponsible parents would have been the difference between crimes being perpetrated again a child and not. Be a parent.
When the kid pays their own bills then it is invasion of privacy.
Personally I’d argue that a 13 year-old has no need for a phone in the first place (except maybe a ‘dumbphone’ that’s only capable of calling and texting; no camera or internet access), but maybe I’m just old-fashioned lol
History of the account tells all.
Under 18 is fair game. The question is whether your motives are worth the emotional fallout. It’s a violation of privacy in the same way as searching their room. I would suggest taking the stronger relationship route if you can. If you think the issue is important enough, do what a parent needs to do; but I cannot tell you what that is in this case…
Why the hell does she have a phone!!?? Parents need to parent…
As far as I’m concerned, my minor child’s privacy is my business if I’m looking out for their safety. Good thing I looked to because I didn’t realize on Roblox the players could talk to each other and some asshole in Scotland was making a suicide pact with my daughter and he taught her to cut herself. Was it a man? Maybe? Was he in Scotland? Who knows? Was s(he) going to kill himself with her? No way! Kids have no idea the dangers that are out there in cyberspace and there are A LOT of creepers who prey on the young and vulnerable. You MUST know what’s going on with them at all times to keep them safe until their brains fully develop and they can protect themselves.
Absolutely not.
It only becomes inappropriate when they are paying the bill.
There isn’t much to go off here in regards to present, past relationship with your children. I’m sorry this is happening to you but you need to learn the skills to parent. I read that your other kids are the same. There is some disconnect here. It’s not too late. Sit down with a third party and have an honest discussion and be open to criticism and learning. Your daughter might feel these friends are all she has and no one but them understand her. Good luck
13 is a bit too young to have a phone or internet access, most websites barely tolerate 13 year olds. many have policies against people so young. if theres trouble with police and school it sounds like the child doesn’t have the maturity for a phone imo. be a parent and step up! maybe everyone should take a visit to a therapist too just to check in on developmental problems or behavioral issues.