My friend is being verbally abused by her husband. I feel like I want to ask him directly if he is aware that he is hurting her and causing her harm. But I feel like if I call him out, he might either go “Oh i should change my behavior” or he will torment her more, maybe even shame her for confiding in friends.
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Yeah. Few years ago I had a few too many drinks, thought I was being funny but my mate pulled me up and told me I was being an asshole to my wife.
Straightened me right out
Never get involved in someone else’s marriage. Ever. Unless she’s being beaten, of course.
If you told off her husband, you wouldn’t just piss him off. You’d piss HER off. And, if you’re a guy, you’ll be accused of a hidden agenda.
Until she grows the requisite backbone to do something about it, it will continue.
You should mind your own business. If she’s choosing to stay in that relationship then you giving your opinion will just offend them both. If she asks you for help, you should help her leave him and not try to change him, it won’t work.
This is a tricky situation.
What consists of “verbal abuse” in one cultures isn’t in another. I’ve seen this happen and was shocked to learn that it’s just a part of their communication style and it’s not abuse at all.
I’m not saying this is what’s happening in your case, however it’s important to confirm that it’s indeed abuse for your friend, and not you. (In other words, take your own feelings out of the equation).. Speak to your own friend, and see if she wants to discuss this topic… if she doesn’t, respect her privacy and do not interfere! If she does, suggest that she speaks to a professional. In the meantime you can listen to her POV and let her come to her own conclusions, don’t guide her hand, don’t affect her relationship, don’t share what you would do in her situation. Listen and be supportive and let her make her own decisions. Be a friend, not a therapist. Reason is; abuse victims tend to boomerang either to their own abusive partner or someone just like them, if they weren’t truly convinced that this environment isn’t healthy for them…
And finally; do not discuss this directly with her husband as nothing good will come out of it in any shape or form.
It gets you yelled at and you end up blocking him across the board
Mind your business. You can’t help who she loves.
Gets you more abuse unless you follow it up with a threat of your own. And then make good on that threat.
Really depends on whether he’s receptive. You could try indirect methods first, showing examples of a guy talking his wife nicely or one where he’s clearly abusive, and articulating that the latter is such
As you type he’s verbally abusing? This rage bait?!
Always check people on their bullshit, just make sure you’re doing it in a safe environment where you don’t put yourself at risk. A good friend does the hard things, a bad friend does what is easiest for themselves.
If he’s older (which I assume he is), it’s a toss up. When I was in high school, I called out one of my friend’s for being an abusive piece of shit to his girlfriend. It was totally unexpected and wild to witness, because he was always such an even-tempered guy in every other context. He took what I said seriously, and the girl he dated at the time thanked me years later for it.
I’m assuming the guy you’re referring to is 30+, and if that’s the case, I think it might be better if it comes directly from her (or from you while you’re with her if she’s too afraid), but give her a place to go if it doesn’t go well, please. The line between verbal abuse and choking the shit out of a defenseless woman can be scary thin for some guys.
If she can’t or won’t call him out herself and have some self respect, then I’m afraid your comment has a low percent chance of doing anything. It starts and ends with what she will allow.
Rarely. This will only have an impact if he actually cares about her, which, if he is abusing her, he likely does not care about her.
He’s being abusive to her because he thinks it is okay to mistreat her. Abusive men are abusive because they think it is okay to be abusive – that’s the long and short of the causes of their behavior.
Helping your friend leave the relationship will be the best thing you can do.
It’s their marriage. Worry about your own relationships.
Different relationships, not yours, no written rules
Approach with curiosity, not judgment.
All the ‘mind your business’ responses are breaking my heart, honestly. Although I do get the sentiment.
I’d say first talk to your friend. There’s always the risk of you seeing problems when there are none. If it’s bothering her, yeah you might want to talk to him. If it leads to him tormenting her more, that’s a good invitation to talk to her about standing up for herself. Either by talking back or leaving him, depending on the situation.
As someone who has been verbally abusive to a ex, I -wish- someone confronted me about it while there was still a relationship to work on. I really didn’t see what I was doing, and regret causing her grief. That being said, some abusers are less open to feedback and possibly more aggressive than I was. So it’s up to you (and other people in her network) to make an estimation about what’s the best way to go in the long run.
Sand Blasting is a very real process.
Being hit by 1 single fast piece of sand may annoy most. Some will change their behavior to avoid more. Some will get mad and act like a jerk about it.
However, the sand blasting is only truly effective when all of society is calling a behavior out and someone is being hit repeatedly over and over relentlessly.
“Calling him out” in public or in front of others will make him defensive and likely have the opposite effect.
If you’re in a position that you can talk to him one on one, do so, but approach it out of concern for him. His behaviour may be a symptom of something he’s dealing with. Once you’ve had a chance to address what might be the matter for him, then you can also express concern that his behaviour might be having a negative impact on others.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/DARVO
I find this useful for structuring my thoughts on whether something is abuse, and the next step is to figure out whether it is willing or unconscious.
However, if your friend feels there is a need to address the situation I would suggest to take her out of said situation for some time. If the potential abuser will not change for the sake of the partner returning and staying, consider other options.
Also, your friend will realise that being ‘alone’ isn’t as scary as it sounds.
Naturally, the amount of information provided is limited so that is what I work with.
Godspeed.
Sometimes. If you do it in public it’s a signal to other guys nearby, “do not do this thing”
It depends on the basic psychological makeup of the guy. If he has a fundamentally healthy mental organization and is just being an asshole in that moment they can be reasoned into observing how they come off and genuinely change.
At the other end of the spectrum, someone whose psychology is deranged enough to fall into severe cluster B traits isn’t gonna learn shit from you, and they’ve probably abused every SO they’ve had. A single conversation with them will be useless, and only a determined therapist can help. The difference between these two people is pretty easy to spot for the trained eye but not so obvious for those unfamiliar with the archetypes.
If he seems basically well-adjusted, I would recommend having a private conversation with the guy and telling him how he comes off. Some people grew up in households of yelling and anger, and have that as their primary model of how to treat their partner. A lot of what they do is subconscious and they can have a eureka moment of shame and guilt when called out. On the other hand, if he’s a fucking scary nutcase hovering next to you with crazy eyes all the time and saying weird shit, don’t talk to him and tell your friend to GTFO.
Personal anecdote: friend of mine is from an extremely traumatized family of war refugees. The first psychologically healthy guy she dated was from a reserved midwestern family when she was in her early 30s. She always wondered why he didnt yell at her, and she herself would often raise her voice when angry. When it was explained what she was doing she was totally taken aback, and now has a much healthier method of expressing her feelings.
You gave zero context or content on what “verbally abusing” is referring to. Without any real information here, I say mind your business.
Why do you call it abuse, and what actions are you even talking about? Does she love him, and is she happy? She could be blind to the abuse, but you could also be completely misjudging what is happening. Do you have a close relationship with him? Why don’t you give her advice instead of him? If he truly is abusing, why would he listen to your calm rationality? If he would be receptive to a conversation about it, why isn’t that coming from her??
Too many unanswered questions, too many variables to be able to make a solid judgement.
if it’s a real friend, i would check with her first, and let her know that you’re available to help her if there’s ever a problem. then recommend therapy. if there’s physical abuse, step up to the guy and let him know you won’t tolerate it. make sure you can back it up.
Yes, it does. Nothing affects men more than peer pressure. Be sure to call them out in front of other men, if possible; Not only does it have more impact, it will also tell those men where you stand, and what you think. Set a standard.
Depends who, how, and how often.
I am assuming you mean historically. No. He’s definitely not gonna go “oh I should change my behavior.” If he had that sort of self awareness he wouldn’t do it. He’ll just know not to be verbally abusive in front of you and to keep your friend away from you.
The best shot you have is talking to your friend and seeing if she’s ready to leave. If she’s not, you kinda have to drop it. You can’t force people to do things they don’t want to do. Pressing the issue too much will cause her to withdraw from you and run further into his arms. Your friend is grown and is making a decision. You have to accept that. Trying to save someone who doesn’t want to be saved is a losing battle
Probably not going to do much, sadly. And I don’t agree with a lot of people here. I’ll explain why at the end.
He’s either subconsciously or consciously verbally abusing her.
If it’s subconscious, it’s an ingrained controlling behavior he’s developed that he’s not aware of and he’s just trying to maintain “safety” around him (stability) in a very unhealthy way.
If it’s conscious, it’s all of that but he’s knows what and why he’s doing it and that’s worse.
He very likely won’t self-reflect after you say something, because he very likely doesn’t self-reflect on what he does now.
Like if I blow up on someone because I’ve reached my limit, I am going to feel like shit because I know they didn’t deserve it.
He feels like she deserves it. She’s beneath him.
I went through an emotionally abusive relationship with an alcoholic covert narcissist. Your friend likely feels embarrassed, ashamed, and lost. You don’t want to isolate your friend by attacking her partner, though he’d deserve it, or by pressuring them to leave. She’s in a toxic cycle most likely of getting the courage to leave and then being pulled back in by love bombing or glimpses of the guy who she thinks this guy is.
Your best bet is to share opinions and pointing out bad behavior but not accusing, rather pointing out why.
“How are you feeling after he yelled at you over getting the wrong drink? That behavior isn’t okay.”
She’s in a situation where she’s not sure if it’s normal or not. Where she’s being made to think she’s the problem and his reaction, while bizarre, must be worth it because when she apologizes or cowers he showers her with affection later.
Asking if she’s okay with the behavior and seeing if she needs help is key.
For sure diffuse situations if they happen in front of you. But just know that being very aggressive can make it worse and isolate her.
I can let emotions dictate my actions, unfortunately. I’ve had people tell me I’m being an ass, and it was a wake up call for me.
I’ve also seen people be told their being an ass and not give a shit.
I think it depends on the person, this isn’t a generalized thing.
No. The best thing is to help the abused person find a path to exit the abusive relationship. A leopard can’t change its spots. However, it can eat your face.
Most abusers are not evil people actually, so they can be fixed, maybe.
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This post was mass deleted and anonymized with Redact
It might. It took being called out for me to realize certain things. Now, if he doesn’t care it won’t change him, but hearing about it might help your friend realize she’s being abused and it’s not normal.
I would call out my friend to their face if I knew them as a person. I wouldn’t call out a husband of a friend unless they asked for help.
Typically, no. While abusive people know that society doesn’t agree with what they are doing, typically, they do not actually think they are wrong, they think society is.
The best thing you can do is be there for your friend. If she wants to leave help her get a go bag together, get some funds together, and find a safe place to escape to.
I think that for every guy who might take it well, there’s two more who will take it out on his wife. Tread carefully.
You should talk to the wife before you do anything. If I’ve learned anything in my life, it is that if we’re trying to protect people, we should try and do it in a way that is empowering to them, not disempowering.
If you shoot from the hip, the husband may actually ratchet up the abuse when you’re not around.
If you talk to the wife, and she sees she is being abused, she might help you figure out the right way to help her.
I think if you have your friend alone you gotta make a joke that the sex must be amazing if he can get away with talking/treating you that way.
A lot of time I feel like things are normalized in a relationship and making a comment as a jest can get people thinking.
I honestly think that if she is YOUR friend you can ask her on a one on one if she think this is ok or normal and that when he does it I front of other or makes other uncomfortable and that you are worry that when people are not around that it is much worst.
For physical abuse you can bring the authority if she feels is needed. Verbal abuse is different as she is the only one that can speak up and make changes. If you say something they/him might make it harder to be around you. Therefore I do not think face to face confrontation will solve the issue, unless your relationship with her is more important to her than their relationship.
If it is a close group of friends then you guys can do an intervention. I know it sounds like a sitcom thing but I think when it is the group rather than one person and examples are presented it is harder to just ignore or brush off.
Good luck.
OP so what does your friend say about it when you ask her why she tolerates it? Is he possibly physically abusing her as well? There is absolutely nothing wrong with you standing up for your friend but you need to keep her safety in mind.
Depends on how you go about it
I have gotten a female friend out of an abusive relationship and even gotten the guy she was married to to be better man in the long run. I am not saying he turned out to be prince charming or anything but he did thank me for being a better person towards women.
The whole situation started because 2 guys, my exbf and my late fiancé, asked me to do. Basically they wanted me to sell him weed. They were tired of him talking shit about women in the kitchen. He asked them for weed and while they could get it theyasked me to sell it to him so he would have to go through a women to get it. I said yeah because I like fucking with guys like that.
The problem was that no one expected me to get along with his gf. She is one of the sweetest women I have ever met. I usually have guy friends but me and his girlfriend became fast friends. I also fell in love with his 2 daughters. His youngest is actually in Mensa and is a genius and his oldest was bright and just fun to be around.
I sort of became determined to get this guy away from all 3 of them.
It took a few years and me fighting with his girlfriend who became his wife and I was even a bridesmaid at their wedding but I accomplished my goal.
I only almost beat the crap out of him once at one of his daughters birthdays for leaving to get some supplies while we were setting up the party and then coming back high on heroin halfway through the party.
It took me a few years but she finally left him and the girls ended up happy with their biomom. There were a lot of discussions between me and my friend why she should leave him. Part of the problem is the girls were her step kids and she was afraid to leave them by themselves with him. I would point out that she is teaching them that behavior from a guy was okay and they should put up with it. We never did figure out the perfect way to handle that situation in all our discussions about it. I don’t think there is a right way. It’s more like figuring out the least bad way of dealing with it.
I never confronted him on his abuse but I had no problem putting him in his place when he was being an asshole. A few years ago he hit me up on Facebook and when everything was said and done apparently I taught him women were more than subservient beings and that women could be strong like a man could. Like I said not perfect but better than he was before. He now considers women human beings so yay.
I should point out that all this happened before social media existed.
Just because it’s funny. I still talk to his ex. When we were younger she always wanted to be a SAHM and I always wanted to grow weed for a living. She now has a pot farm and I am a SAHM. Life is funny that way.
The word abuse is way overused on this platform it’s so difficult to know when these posts are legitimate. Given reddits generally clientele, I’m guessing this isn’t abuse.
Yes, but only if you’re willing to go all the way. Which is not the safest thing in the world.
And never mind this “is he aware” milquetoast stuff…he’s got seventeen levels of denial going on in his head excusing his behavior. Just make it clear that you’re watching, you’re keeping track, and at certain point you’re going to take steps if it doesn’t start.
He’s under the control of a compulsion, so he’s got no bottom. He will ALWAYS have an excuse. He will deflect and perhaps even threaten. But if he knows there will be direct consequence EVERY TIME he gives in…there is a CHANCE he’ll do the things he’s got to do. He’s counting on people looking away and becoming his accomplices.
You have to match his will, which you CAN do. But you’d better be ready to go into some places that are going to make you question humanity.
Not gonna be a popular comment, but is there a chance she’s just as bad as him in other settings? Not saying that’s for sure what’s happening, but it wouldn’t be the first time a girl vented to other guys about her husband without mentioning that she’s problematic too.
Years ago I had a friend who seemed to have the sweetest wife who he just didn’t seem to appreciate at all. I couldn’t believe how cold he could be when talking about her or even some of the things he say when she was around… then I was around them at home and realized.. she’s straight up abusing him verbally and emotionally around the clock. Like dude doesn’t get a second of peace unless she’s in public and trying to maintain her sweet girl image. My guess is the only time he had any power over her was by trying to push her buttons in front of other people to see if she’d change in front of him.
It depends for some guys that’s how they were raised and they don’t know any better.so for them yes it can make a difference eventually. But for the guys who are spiteful, malicious, manipulative no it won’t change anything.
You need to contemplate if your friend is asking for help, or just venting to you.
But if you’re also friends with him, have your friend’s blessing to do so, and think you can bring it to his attention without being overtly confrontational, then maybe you have a chance of success.
If you’re just looking to confront him or call him out because your friend won’t and you’re angry about the situation.. then he’s most likely going to dismiss everything you say, get angry about it, and take it out on her for airing dirty laundry outside the relationship. You wouldn’t be doing her any favors
Needs more info
Fella i used be friends with was out of order with his then girlfriend, i called him out on it, (in another room, but loud enough that she heard me). She told me later that she was planning on leaving him.
To my shame i just told her they’d work it out, but on speaking with her years later she told me that it meant alot to her that i was sticking up for her.
Call fuckers out on their bullshit, and learn from your own mistakes
Get her info for counseling in ways that he doesn’t know about, but do not call him out. You very easily can do more damage than good. Hurt this dude’s pride and he could very easily become physically abusive to her. Or he could start to keep her away from her friends. Or he could get himself worked up into a lather and really do some bad shit.
Please stay out of it.
You normally have to give bullies a taste of their own medicine unfortunately
Is this something you observe directly?
Or is this just what she tells you?
It usually takes two to tango, although that can be an up/down dynamic.
Depends on the dude. Most dudes wont care what you got to say unless you’re a dude too, and at that point it can really go in any direction, up to and including a fight.
This is all assuming you’re not friends, if one of his best buds says something it’ll likely be a different story.
If I were in your shoes and I knew one of his close friends, I’d talk to that person.
Yes it does. You should speak out to your friend. You don’t even have to crouch it as helping his wife, your helping him not be a shitty person.
This is something that would come best from OP’s boyfriend as a casual conversation over a beer. He will listen much more as this would be coming from a 3rd party observation versus her friend.
Does it always fix things? No. Is it always worth doing? Yes
Talk to her first
Verbally abusive how?
Have you seen it?
Only people that can change are the ones whi want to change. Sorry but you probably won’t accomplish anything by raising with the dickhead other than cause more shit for your friend who will probably be hit with “You tell your friends I abuse you” or something derivative of it
Is she’s your friend, help her. Too many questions to give specifics but gotta look out for your friends
I’d focus more on her exit strategy; IOW I’d encourage her to make the decision to leave. Calling him out might escalate things.
I cant think of a single reason why a guy wouldn’t take the advice of someone he doesn’t care about over the person he shares his life with.
Your friend will definitely love you and appreciate you for fixing her husband by simply asking him to be better, (it’s not her fault she’s too stupid to think of that herself — you’re just that smart).
You’ll feel more empowered to meddle in other marriages after you fix this one and that benefits every couple around you too. Its a win-win-win.
I wouldn’t get involved honestly. I only say that from experience. Lost friends over it and even when the relationship ended with them, our friendship never recovered. Be there when someone needs you and asks for it but that’s as far as it should go.
Hmm, it kind of depends.
Your friend deserves to have someone stand up for her, but it is very unwise to challenge someone openly if you aren’t prepared for immediate backlash in response.
I think you need to talk to your friend and have some kind of a plan rather than springing this up on the guy when he’s already in an “engaged” state of mind.
Whatever you do, do not underestimate an abuser’s capacity for violence.
He may never have harmed her at all before, but under the right circumstances, someone who has already displayed patterns of abuse is more likely to double down on their behavior under extreme stress. It could cause harm to you and your friend if things were to go wrong – assuming that he is actually that volatile, of course.
Just be careful, OP. Protect your friend, and protect yourself.
I had an ex who would go at me until I got verbal and then the argument would end after she got the reaction she was after and she was satisfied that I was the bad guy.
Been in multiple relationships since and never had the issue with anyone else. Quite the opposite.
Not saying he’s innocent (nor was I) but maybe your friend is the problem.
If a relationship goes toxic get the fuck out it’s never going to be good again.
You don’t know what that woman puts that man through. At the end of the day yo can trust you’re friend or whatever but but out
I personally do not think you intervention will help the situation. The best thing is she knows you are there for her and you will help her when/if she decides to leave.
Tough situation as it could go either way. But often doing nothing is almost as bad as doing what turns out to be the wrong thing. At least if it escalates chances are she may leave rather that forever dealing with his shit.
I thought my generation had already done this enough so yours would have learned from it. You can support your friend but do NOT get involved between the two of them.