My brother is a single dad with a 9 year old son. My nephew’s mom is not in the picture. For the last 3 years my brother has been dating Kayla and for the last two years my brother and Kayla have introduced their son’s (her son is also 9) to each other and they spend time as a group.
The boys do not like each other and my brother has told me that both of them complain and try to get out of spending time together. The first time they met it was at a kids play center and within 10 minutes the boys were playing with different groups of kids. The second time they went to see a movie and Kayla’s son moved seats to sit next to his friend. The third time my nephew went to listen to a different story time but in the same library obviously. Other times they brought them to the amusement park 20 minutes from my brother’s house and they chose to go on different rides to each other and when they went on the same one they chose to be in different rows or karts.
When they’ve spent time at each other’s houses they do their own thing. When they play games together they want to partner with their parent and not each other and when they were forced to it ended in them fighting and refusing to play. They have attended each other’s birthday parties and there were no interactions beyond forced ones.
My brother and Kayla tried to plan sleepovers and were left with two kids who did not want to hang out with each other. If they can avoid it they won’t sit next to or across from each other at meals.
My brother and Kayla wanted to move in together and get married but the boys are still avoiding each other and not getting along. Both say they don’t like the other and I’m not sure if reasons were asked or given but neither of them were okay with the idea of the four living together.
My brother said Kayla wants to try living together and making it work but he’s not sure and he’s worried he could lose my nephew to the decision eventually or that it will hurt their relationship. He asked me what I’d do and I said I would end a relationship if my kid and their kid could not get along. I said sibling fighting is normal but these boys aren’t siblings yet and when there are no good moments or moments where they want to or are okay with being around each other it seems like a recipe for disaster.
Our mom told me not to discourage my brother and that things like this can be worked on. She told me when my brother left that I should have just supported him. AITA?
Comments
Nta! Truly if he listens to you he might save his relationship with his son! Because another partner can be found but another son?
I’d say no. I have kids and I’d want my kids to like the other person and if they had kids their kids. Other-words it is a recipe for disaster.
If you’re not going to take advice well, then don’t ask for it. People really need to stop seeking validation from others just to make their own decisions.
Don’t ask for advice if you don’t want to hear the answer…
I would try to find the reason why they don’t get along, not force them. It leads to resentment. I wouldn’t move in together with someone my kids don’t feel comfortable with.
You work on things BEFORE you upend the children’s lives, not after you’ve moved in against their wishes. These parents need to stop being selfish and actually talk to their kids. Your mum is a fool, someone needs to advocate for the kids, that’s the parents’ job but they’re not doing it.
NTA your brother didn’t ask your mother, he asked you. Probably because he knows all that he’s going to get from your mother is validation, and he’s looking for actual advice.
NTA
He asked for your opinion and you gave it to him. Your mom is right, there might be ways to solve cases like this. But there are enough stories that show forcing kids to be siblings is not really healthy for the parent – kids relationship.
So I think it’s a good thing you didn’t follow the happy narrative that kids are flexible, it all will work out in the end and let’s just move in and test things. That’s when kids ( and people in general) stop telling you how they really feel because what’s the point when they weren’t listened to before.
NTA.
You are allowed to voice your opinion in this situation and I’d share your view.
NYA. But you also can tell him that you wouldn’t move on with the partner, but stay in the relationship, but each partner lives on their own with their kids.
NTA.
He was asking how would handle it. You’re giving your feelings on the matter AFTER he asked for them.
I don’t know if it would help anything at this point, but have they considered family counseling? With the state of their various relationships, they should go see a professional before making major decisions and changes.
Sounds like brothers already.
MTA you spoke the truth, the kids wont get better just because they’re living in the same house, inface it’ll get worse because they wont be able to get away from each other. they are showing your brother and his gf that they don’t want to spend an time together, trying to make them will alienate your nephew from your brother eventually, and what happens them or if gf gets pregnant, will the nephew be forced to play big brother too.
oh and your mum is only thinking ‘oh i get another grandchild’ not of the grandchild she already has.
NTA. It seems brother is only “thinking” with his “lower head.” Neither son likes the other & like you said, “it’s a recipe for disaster.” Incidentally, what’s gf’s take on her son’s attitude? Trying to FORCE a relationship to bloom between 2 sons who aren’t interested? Nope, it’s not gonna happen.
“Mom” wants OP to support her brother? What? Give him money? Offer counselling services? Whether mom likes it or not, brother’s life is his own, and truth is truth. The boys aren’t going to get along.
I think you’re right: brother prob’ly ought break it off, or demote gf to fwb. (Is it actually are relationship, or is it fwb?)
NTA! Unlike your mothers opinion on what you should have done, yours was requested by your brother. If he wanted her opinion he would have asked. The relationship will go sour with his son if he continues to not listen to his child. And also bringing someone he hates in his safe space is crazy. Tell me one adult that bring someone they hate to live with them and be mentally stable? Why make the kids lives miserable so your brother and his gf can be happy? They took responsibility when they had kids, they should act like it.
I did not hang out with my siblings much, your brother and Kayla are trying to force something that may never happen. They need to talk to the kids to see if they are opposed to their relationship, or just do not want to be forced to act as siblings.
NAH. I think your point of view is fair, but I think your brother’s is too. I realize I’m in the minority, but I don’t think their relationship necessarily has to end because the kids don’t want to be BFFs. But the parents DO absolutely need to stop forcing a relationship that isn’t there. Like they 100000% need to back off. If they can do that, and if the boys can coexist peacefully and politely, then I think that’s ok; there are plenty of full blood siblings who don’t get on and this doesn’t sound that extreme: the boys just don’t like each other. That’s ok! For what it’s worth, my mom remarried and I have 4 stepbrothers. We weren’t close then and 18 years later aren’t close now. It’s cool, when we see each other at holidays we say hi and move along. It can work, but the parents have to chill out
NTA but if they truly want to have a relationship this could be a good lesson for both of the boys. Therapy. We all have to deal with people we don’t like in our lives, this is a good lesson for them both. If they provide separate rooms and understand that both of their boys are different individuals. Family therapy would be a must here.
If they don’t want to make that effort above, then they both should move on.
“Making it work”.
He actually said that wow.
The time for working on things is before living together.
NTA
This would be a shitshow.
If it were the right person though I’d be OK with waiting till the kids were older amd just keep on with sleepovers and non forced outings.
Sounds like the boys will go as a group just not interact.
Stop forcing things
NTA
But your brother would be in much better shape if they stopped forcing a relationship between the two. They don’t need to be brothers or friends. They merely have to be tolerant and polite to live together.
NTA, and your mother is wrong. You are unfortunately dead-on for your response to your brother. At very minimum, there should be no discussion of moving in together, much less marriage. It won’t be a happy family. And as those boys get older, it will get much worse. As much as you want happiness for all of them, not the time to move forward. Besides, what is the rush?
Yes OP YTA for not lying to your brother. You’ve got to be joking
Info: how does your nephew feel about Kayla?
My ex chose his new partner and her kids over ours. He hasn’t seen them in nearly 10 years. It is a detectable thing to do. I hope your brother listens.
Adults have choices in these situations, kids don’t. By the time his son has a choice, it may be to never see his Dad (or your crappy advice giving mom) again.
NTA for answering the question your brother asked you.
I think better advice would be to ask the kids why they don’t like each other. At that age, 9/10 times you can usually get worst enemies to become best friends with a simple conversation. Half the kids I fist fought at that age I ended up becoming friends with eventually
NTA. He asked for advice, and you said how you felt. However, your mom’s opinion may be based on some wisdom. If they moved in together, and both of the boys had their own rooms, and neither was forced to have a relationship with the other outside of family meals, or certain activities that they all do together, then possibly they could learn to work things out.
I think the key is letting them coexist if that’s all they want, and making sure that each of the kids still gets a fair share of time and attention. From what you said, the only times they were actually fighting is when someone made them play together. It’s possible that they might find that they have some things in common if it’s allowed to evolve organically.
They will never like each other no matter how many times they put them together. His son will hate him if they move in…
Trying to force the kids to befriends is a dangerous idea. As long as they’re not bad-mouthing each other or being otherwise rude and disrespectful to each other or each other’s parent, let them be themselves.
They should at least keep separate homes.
You were asked and gave your honest opinion. You are not the ass.
Telling the truth is supporting him. Playing happy families when nothing is happy about is not support.
He and Kayla could live in their own places with their own kids until the boys are grown if it is important.
Or they can break up.
NTA
NTA. In the hypothetical world where I have kids, if my kid didn’t like my partner or my partners kid, I wouldn’t continue the relationship. You can chose your partner but your child can’t choose their parents. And every child deserves me to heard by their parents.
Nope. This will never work out.
This goes beyond not liking each other. These two kids are refusing to interact. Kids dont need to like each other to live together. If they were indifferent it wouldnt be an issue. Two people who are indifferent to each other live together just fine, just ask my college roommate freshman year.
This is past that. It’s not as far as bullying thankfully, but it not a acceptable living situation either. If the parents want to make the situation work they should start off with family therapy. But if they cant get the kids to the point of politely doing basic activities together then the adults need to rethink the living situation. Maybe not break up, but probably not live together until the kids either figure things out or move out.
NTA but maybe they need to go to family therapy to get to the bottom of it. Please update us
He asked your opinion, I don’t think he can be mad you have an honest answer. NTA
The thing is, they might not have to end it, they just might not be able to progress to co-habitating at this time. Leave it for a few years, maybe the boys will get along better.
they can wait 9 more years and get married then.
Every man that I know who merged families said it they would go back, they would never have done it. Worst mistake they ever made. The women usually neglect their own children in favor of their stepchildren, then act like martyrs and victims
NTA. Yeah if he goes forward it’s going to damage his relationship with his son. I mean he doesn’t yell at his dad and say I hate him I hate her I don’t want you to seeing her. He just does not want to be around her kid. It would be terrible for them to live together especially if they made them share a room. Well he either keeps seeing her and they don’t live together or get married till the kids are 18 or they put them on opposite sides of the house and tell them till tells them they don’t need to interact together but they’re not to be mean to each other which it doesn’t sound like they are they just avoid each other like the plague.
So they just either don’t go up to the next level or they break up. But now if something happened to my husband when my kids were young and they hated whoever I was seeing kids, no I wouldn’t move forward with the relationship.
So do the boys hate each other or just don’t share similar interest/personalities? Maybe the parents are trying too hard.
Coexisting can be okay as long as they both feel loved and cared for and have their needs met and aren’t being bullied or force. Even 9 year olds can learn to have a house mate with no expectations other than being thoughtful.
Sounds like the parents screwed this up by trying to hard to turn them into best friends.
Supporting him doesn’t mean cosigning his delusion. You’re supporting him like a sister should by gently telling him the truth.
Updateme
NTA. I agree with you you can’t force a relationship and I think the choice should as a parent be the child over the partner
NTA. You’re right and your brother, his gf and your mom are all wrong!
They could invest time and money into therapy to see if somehow a peaceful coexistence can be forged between the boys but ultimately, if they just don’t like each other, it’s a huge mistake to force the issue.
Better for everyone if your brother and his gf maintain separate homes and lives for another 9 years. Once the boys are off to college or launched into their own lives, Mom and Dad will be free to move in together if they still want to.
At this point its really early to know.theyre nine, they just simply shouldnt force the kids to hang out. The relationship could still work. Even if they lived together, as long as the parents are fair, as they grow up,they will become civil or actually start to like each other unless there is unknown factor as to why they dislike each other
Updateme
NTA. When it’s kids, esp when they’re old enough to understand, you can’t force anything. Also, do they genuinely not like each other or do they just not wanna be forced to be friends?
NTA He asked for your opinion and you gave it.
Sometimes people don’t like each other and that’s okay. Kids are people to and they shouldn’t be force to have a relationship with someone they do not like.
Personally if I was in that situation I would try to find out if their dislike of each other is something that can be worked through (ex: are they taking resentment out on each other for something deeper?) or is it one of these situation where you just can’t stand someone for no specific reasons and that’s just it. I wouldn’t make any big decision without asking my child how they feel and what they want, have my partner do the same with her child and go from there. I wouldn’t make big decisions without communicating and listening.
I also wouldn’t organise bonding time, « family » outing or plan to move in if it could make my son miserable. Especially without knowing what was going on in his head.
But ultimately, kids should always come first and if you need to end up a relationship for your child’s well being then you got to step up as a parent and do it 🤷🏻♀️
They may actually be jealous of each other.
Yes he could end the relationship because they look like never being best friends, but I suspect it will happen in any situation where there is another kid or kids.
I wouldn’t be so keen to end it all without getting some type of counseling to be honest. If one or the other can’t be bothered to at least explore the possibly, then they aren’t fully committed to the relationship.
My main belief is that nothing should be forced. Some people will never like certain people, but the whole world doesn’t revolve around them, and everyone needs to bear that in mindand be civil.
Also, one day these kids will grow up and leave home, they won’t be there forever.
Adults have a right to pursue happiness, not just kids.
I definitely wouldn’t move in together before getting advice from a relationship counselor and getting to the bottom of it all first though – first without the children, and later with each child separately, then together.
Blended families do not always blend. It cannot and never should be forced.It can become a serious issue and cause resentment if not downright hate. They might try getting the boys into therapy separately to try and find out why they dislike each other. What may seem minor to adults can be major to kids. Some issues can sometimes be worked on others cannot. He asked for your opinion and you gave it. NTA. mom needs to stay out of it tho.
NTA. The kids don’t have to become best friends but there has to be enough mutual respect for one another’s space and to basically just get along. If your brother moves forward anyway, the boys should not be expected to share a room or an attempt made to force a friendship. The best thing the couple can do is continue to take it slow. Their children need to come first.
NTA
He asked what you would do, you told him.
I’ve known some people who had a horrible, hateful relationships with siblings, and parents who looked the other way or told them it was their job to keep the peace. What wound up happening is they learned to lean on found family instead. Once a child loses faith that their family cares about their happiness it’s a tough situation to come back from.
NTA. Kids get to be minors for 18 very short years and when you become a parent, the kid is your priority. They can date until the boys are older. My concern is that when nephew hits 13. he can decide whether he wants to spend time with Dad.
Only suggestion is to have them try family counseling. Maybe the boys are just different or jealous. Therapy would be good for everyone.
NTA but i do think that if he does move forward with her that one thing they can do to save both their relationship and their relationship with their kids, is simply not force the kids into spending time with each other. Don’t force them to be friends or to do activities or pretend like they’re family. That would probably have helped things a lot. One reason the boys don’t like the idea of living together is probably precisely because their parents keep forcing them to do things together when they don’t want to.
Maybe if you speak to him again you can suggest they speak to the boys and tell them that they won’t pressure them to hang out or to act like brothers and to maybe give it a trial run first and see how it goes before making any permanent decisions.
He asked your opinion, you gave him your opinion. If he didn’t like your answer he shouldn’t have asked.
If your brother moves in with Kayla your nephew will go NC with his dad the second he is old enough. This situation only gets worse and atleast one of these kids will end up going off the rails and cutting ties with all family members. This isn’t like making your kid eat vegetables or making sure they do well in school. This is a decision that will be made for purely selfish reasons.
NTA. You are right. You’re brother is right to, he will lose his son if he forces this.
We all see enough stories here and real life, stepfathers can be physically abusive in different forms, stepmothers take more of a psychological and financial abuse.
Kayla already wants to force the living together when the children can’t stand each other. She will always favour her son and this will eventually destroy the relationship your brother has with his son.
As the boys age it’s going to get worse if the foce this situation.
You gave your brother stellar advice. Maybe you need to start sharing some of the stories from here about step siblings being forced together and made to pretend they like each other and the resentment it causes.
Your mother is old school. She thinks affection can be forced. It can’t.
The children came first and should always come first. They could try family counseling and try to get to the root of the problem but at the end of the day, his child is his first choice.
NTA
If he goes through with this, his house will be a prison on planet bullshit
NAH. Kids can be moody and there may be some unresolved issues which may have nothing to do with the other kid. Maybe they feel like they’re being replaced, or any number of things that may be reasonable or unreasonable.
I don’t think the brother should give up on the relationship at this stage but should move slowly.
What’s more important is to see if the two adults can be an effective team. There’s no guarantee that siblings will get along just because they’re related by blood and I would not make major life decisions only based on a few play dates. Values, parenting ideology and thought processes should also align. Maybe if the parents talk to their own child and work through those issues individually, as a couple and as a group(potential family), it would be a recipe for success.
The boys act out on each other bec neither wants their parent in a relationship. Let your brother go to therapy mmand get guidance.
NTA
Your brother and his gf have to put their own kids first and each other in second place, and if that means they can not move in together, they have to accept it.
Therapy could help, maybe, but not all together. He goes with his son, and she goes with hers. If they can figure out what’s behind the dislike the kids have, they might be able to work it out, but if that’s not possible, it’s time to end things.
Children should feel safe and happy in their home. Not on guard, not unhappy, not waiting for a bully to start (if that’s the case) if the boys simply just don’t really like each other, ask them if they would be ok to each just do their own thing, provided each boy has his own bedroom to have his own area for his own thing. That way the parents get their relationship, and the boys get a good home with 2 parents, and they are both free to do their thing.
Does that make sense to anyone else? Or do you think that one is bullying and the other is hiding it out of fear?
Updateme!