This concerns my sister “Lily” who is graduating soon. Our parents taught us the importance of personal hygiene and keeping yourself presentable. But I guess Lily fell off the wagon while dorming in college because it feels like she dropped everything to do with personal hygiene since moving back home.
It’s easier to explain with a list of things she isn’t taking care of:
Hair: Very oily/greasy and always tangled from lack of wash and brushing.
Skin: Also very oily/greasy from no wash.
Nails: Never trims so they’re long and yellow from grime.
Clothes: Clothes themselves are nice but she leaves them sloppy/wrinkled.
Body: Showers once a week tops. I’m not sensitive to smell, but my sister REEKS and honestly makes me gag sometimes.
Lily is upset because she says she can’t get an in-person job in her field and wants to give up. Our parents have tried telling her that presentability/hygiene is as important as credentials when getting jobs, but my sister won’t listen. Lily has a rocky relationship with our family so she takes it as a personal attack rather than them trying to help.
Lily is now blaming sexism and says men are all just intimidated by a competent woman and that’s the sole reason why she hasn’t gotten a job. If she wants to lie to herself, it’s her life. Whatever. What I can’t stand is her trying to make it my problem and expect validation from me.
Lily just did a bunch interviews, but all went cold after and none panned out into jobs. She was venting to me last week about how companies in this field are all boys’ clubs and quick to shoot down a woman they know is intellectually above them. I was basically just like good for you, can I please finish my session in peace now?
Lily got defensive and said she’s just warning me. Then doubled down saying most men are selfish and I should save myself the headache now. She was saying this with my male friends on the voice call.
I had enough and told Lily that her lack of personal hygiene is the real reason no job will hire her, so stop blaming others and think for two seconds: If you were a company owner who needs to impress investors to keep your own family afloat, would you want to be represented by someone who looks and smells like a homeless person, or someone who is presentable and takes care of themselves?
We got into an argument and Lily is now either giving me one-word answers or not saying anything to me at all. I’ll be honest that we argue a lot but Lily normally would have gotten over it by now. Did I do the right thing giving Lola a dose of reality or did I fuck up here?
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This concerns my sister “Lily” who is graduating soon. Our parents taught us the importance of personal hygiene and keeping yourself presentable. But I guess Lily fell off the wagon while dorming in college because it feels like she dropped everything to do with personal hygiene since moving back home.
It’s easier to explain with a list of things she isn’t taking care of:
Hair: Very oily/greasy and always tangled from lack of wash and brushing.
Skin: Also very oily/greasy from no wash.
Nails: Never trims so they’re long and yellow from grime.
Clothes: Clothes themselves are nice but she leaves them sloppy/wrinkled.
Body: Showers once a week tops. I’m not sensitive to smell, but my sister REEKS and honestly makes me gag sometimes.
Lily is upset because she says she can’t get an in-person job in her field and wants to give up. Our parents have tried telling her that presentability/hygiene is as important as credentials when getting jobs, but my sister won’t listen. Lily has a rocky relationship with our family so she takes it as a personal attack rather than them trying to help.
Lily is now blaming sexism and says men are all just intimidated by a competent woman and that’s the sole reason why she hasn’t gotten a job. If she wants to lie to herself, it’s her life. Whatever. What I can’t stand is her trying to make it my problem and expect validation from me.
Lily just did a bunch interviews, but all went cold after and none panned out into jobs. She was venting to me last week about how companies in this field are all boys’ clubs and quick to shoot down a woman they know is intellectually above them. I was basically just like good for you, can I please finish my session in peace now?
Lily got defensive and said she’s just warning me. Then doubled down saying most men are selfish and I should save myself the headache now. She was saying this with my male friends on the voice call.
I had enough and told Lily that her lack of personal hygiene is the real reason no job will hire her, so stop blaming others and think for two seconds: If you were a company owner who needs to impress investors to keep your own family afloat, would you want to be represented by someone who looks and smells like a homeless person, or someone who is presentable and takes care of themselves?
We got into an argument and Lily is now either giving me one-word answers or not saying anything to me at all. I’ll be honest that we argue a lot but Lily normally would have gotten over it by now. Did I do the right thing giving Lola a dose of reality or did I fuck up here?
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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> 1. I told Lily her lack of personal hygiene is the reason she isn’t getting hired 2. Hygiene is a sensitive topic for Lily, as our family has been trying to teach her about it frequently. She seems to think I’m doubling down and invalidating her efforts to find a job in a male-dominated field.
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Contest mode is 1.5 hours long on this post.
NTA. Seems Lilly would benifit from more people telling her the truth and not pretending to be OK with it.
NTA
I mean, you were really rude but it sounds like your parents were being tactful and she just didn’t get it. She does need to get it together to present well in interviews or she will suffer from nearly for a very easy fix . I’m wondering if she has an imputed sense of smell herself and genuinely doesn’t know how she’s coming across:
I’m someone who struggles with smells (like autism sensory melt downs as a child struggles) she needs to learn safe smells. Like I can’t use a good shampoo and conditioner because it triggers me, but I have one that I van use that does the job for my weekly hair wash.
I have safe soaps and such
She physically cannot not have proper hygiene
No joke. I sometimes use dish soap to wash my hands cos it triggers less than some hand soaps.
She needs to learn to figure out how to be clean
Look, you’re not wrong in your assessment of the situation. I’d perhaps be concerned as to why your sister is this way. Was she always like this or did it just happen suddenly/ slowly over a period of time? Perhaps something happened to trigger the decline?
Soft YTA for being abrupt.
NTA
Your parents tried the nice way and didn’t reach your sister and you went the sibling way.
Either she learns from this or she will sit in her own jobless funk for a long time.
NTA
Yes you were harsh but she needs to wake up. Of course it’s easier to blame others and not take any responsibility. But she needs to! She’s probably ashamed of her appearance but instead of acknowledging the problem and changing something she is doubling down and blaming others.
NTA. You sound like a good sister for putting her real needs above her feelings. Hopefully she sees that eventually. Does she have mental health concerns? I’m no doctor but I thought people’s hygiene takes a dive when they’re depressed. Just one idea.
NTA. You were harsh but correct. Nobody wants to work with a stinky person no matter how competent they are.
NTA!
You have to understand that she can’t handle the truth. Companies have told her and she has not listened.
Family has told her and she has not listened.
You have told her and she has not listened.
What more do you want? You cannot be more concerned about her issue than her. Just move forward and maintain your peace.
NTA, but I would be concerned about why Lily has let herself get to that point.
Speaking from experience, keeping up with personal hygiene was really difficult when I was struggling with depression, but I still made an effort to look presentable when I had to go out. I don’t know if that’s what your sister is going through, but it might be worth looking into.
That said, she also needs to learn how to self-reflect and hold herself accountable, instead of blaming other people for her failures and projecting her personal experiences onto you. You did the right thing by pointing it out to her, hopefully it will serve as a wake-up call.
NTA. You gave her a dose of well needed truth. Maybe she needs a therapist as her lack of hygene is not normal. No one wants to work with people who stink.
NTA. If Lily’s theory were true, she wouldn’t even get the interviews. Obviously, they see her resume with her education and experience and think she might be a good fit. If she’s getting in the door but isn’t landing any jobs, she needs to realize that she’s not passing the sniff test – literally. Let her know that because she needs backup to the reasons you’re all giving her. It could be that she’s depressed, as well. If her hygiene was good before and during college and it’s only since she got home that she’s let it go, it might be worth checking in with her about that or at least telling your parents so that they can address it. Good luck to you and to Lily!
NTA but usually its like talking to a brick wall w these people. Maybe show her some ‘AITA for telling my bf to wash his ass/My BF doesnt wipe” posts and say ‘Hey got you a perfect match’. I’m serious, sometimes nothing but soft ridicule works with stinkers. If she were your partner everyone would be like ‘girl he’s an adult pls break up’. So please have in mind that your sister is also an adult. Besides, in my experience oily skin is from bad diet – too many carbs
NTA.
But your parents are TA for not teacher your sister proper personal hygiene. How can someone seriously only shower once a week in a civilized society?
Has anyone considered something happened at college and this her coping mechanism? Or is she depressed?
In my limited experience, someone with sensory issues around bathing recognises it and works out a plan or at least acknowledges it.
Nta for being blunt. The root cause does need to be found though
NTA Sounds like you were brave and kind, refusing to play along with your sister’s…denial? delusion? She’s doing herself so much harm, and she’s feeling the pain. It seems like she needs professional help – neglecting hygiene to the degree you describe and showing no awareness of the consequences isn’t normal. Maybe she should see a doctor? It might help to confirm that there really is a problem, in a relatively safe way that implies that it might be a physical thing to which she’s “nose blind” – and her medical doctor might refer her to a mental health practitioner.
NTA your sister sounds disgusting.
NTA i mean its true but i fear Lily has bigger fish to fry. i fear she may be mentally ill, or suffered some sort of trauma or something
Neglecting hygiene is often a sign of depression. Does she have other symptoms that need to be addressed? She needs to see a doctor to be evaluated for depression or other health problems. If she won’t do that, there isn’t much you can do except suggest she find a work from home job where she doesn’t have to personally interact with people. Customer service is a good job that is entirely remote.
However, if she is currently in school, her teachers or other students should have mentioned her hygiene to her. See if she will talk to a school counselor because they are supposed to help with job searches. They can look over her resume and give her tips on presentation. If she won’t do that and won’t see a doctor, your parents are going to have to make some tough love decisions or financially support her forever.
NTA, the truth hurts and if she is being stubborn about her views, in that she believes she’s doing nothing wrong, she needs that wake up call.
There is no way that someone who looks and smells homeless would be given as much value in an interview regardless of knowledge, in a client facing role. You are going to provide a very negative view for the company, and who really is going to want to be in a room with someone who reeks like that.
I’d send her videos about looking professional for job interviews.
Info, did you say that on the call that your male friends were also on?
I definitely don’t think you’re TA for telling her straight, people need that kind of honesty. However, potential TA for the delivery if you said this to her in front of your friends.
NTA you are obviously right in your reasoning. But it may be that her lack of personal hygiene is a symptom of something else, perhaps a mental issue. I think she should be checked out by a Dr and or psychologist. She may not be just sloppy, but she may have a mental illness. Worth looking into!
Refusal to deal with hygiene issues is a classic symptom of mental health issues such as depression.
>“AITA For telling my sister that her lack of personal hygiene is the real reason no job will hire her and not sexism?”
No, YANTA. Yes, you did the right thing. The rest is up to Lily.
NTA
I’m in a similar situation with my sister here.
Turns out she had depression that was untreated and struggles with executive dysfunction meaning she couldn’t figure the steps out in order to get them done and then add on top of that she struggles with the scents of our stuff at home.
We had a chat as a family as teens about hygiene and now we’re in our 30s my sister showers and brushes her teeth etc but instead of using what we use as “adults” items she does what i do & uses children’s body wash, children’s tooth paste & mouth wash as that helps our sensitivity to things.
We both have it as routines too so she has set days she showers but knows she MUST do the other hygiene stuff daily or weekly (obviously depending on the task) & for myself due to my diagnosis & mental health issues I use a visual schedule in the bathroom to help me keep track…maybe that’d help your sister?
The brushing hair thing may be a simple thing of it hurts her so she won’t do it or it doesn’t connect in her head to use detangling spray or leave in conditioner to make it easier to brush or she could get it cut.
You were kind and sensitive about it and handled it correctly she (Lily) needs to figure out her head and why she is behaving this way.
Has anything changed since college? Did/does she have any bad relationships outside of your family relationship?