Before I even say anything, I want to clarify, I am not ableist. I work with various degrees of people with special needs weekly, and I don’t discriminate against anyone for any reason other than their personality (if you’re an asshole, I’ll be an asshole). With that out of the way, am I the asshole? I work at Buffalo Wild Wings as a server, and we have DoorDashers coming in all the time. A lot of them are familiar faces, because they come in frequently, some even multiple times a day, to pick up to-go orders. There’s one doordasher lady who comes in often with her non-verbal autistic son, probably around 13-14 years old, and almost every time she comes in, he causes some sort of disruption, usually clapping loudly or yelling, but that’s okay, I understand that as a parent you can’t really control that. However, he also causes issues that would be easily avoidable, with discipline****. Last week, the she came in with him, grabbed a lemon out of our lemon holder (the lemons for the drinks), put it in his mouth, and then placed it back in the holder with the rest of the lemons. She did not verbally or physically correct his actions at any point or even apologize for his behavior, she simply went about picking up the order. Today, she came in, again with her son, right as I was carrying a large serving tray, filled with the orders for one of my tables. The son saw the tray, and went straight for it, grabbing some wings off of the tray and knocking it out of my hands, making a huge mess. This was my last straw, and I told the woman that she needed to leave, and that she could not come in here with her son anymore, before removing myself from the situation to go clean sause off of my uniform. There was a bit of a scene, and then my manager ushered her out. So? Was I the asshole? Also idk if it matters, but I am M (20)
****EDIT
People seem to be interpreting this wrong, and I may have misphrased it. When I say “easily avoided with discipline” what I mean is, when he does these things, she does not course correct him or scold him of stop him. She allows him to do what he’s doing, without intervention. She watches him do these inappropriate actions without any attempt at correction.
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Before I even say anything, I want to clarify, I am not ableist. I work with various degrees of people with special needs weekly, and I don’t discriminate against anyone for any reason other than their personality (if you’re an asshole, I’ll be an asshole). With that out of the way, am I the asshole? I work at Buffalo Wild Wings as a server, and we have DoorDashers coming in all the time. A lot of them are familiar faces, because they come in frequently, some even multiple times a day, to pick up to-go orders. There’s one doordasher lady who comes in often with her non-verbal autistic son, probably around 13-14 years old, and almost every time she comes in, he causes some sort of disruption, usually clapping loudly or yelling, but that’s okay, I understand that as a parent you can’t really control that. However, he also causes issues that would be easily avoidable, with discipline. Last week, the she came in with him, grabbed a lemon out of our lemon holder (the lemons for the drinks), put it in his mouth, and then placed it back in the holder with the rest of the lemons. She did not verbally or physically correct his actions at any point or even apologize for his behavior, she simply went about picking up the order. Today, she came in, again with her son, right as I was carrying a large serving tray, filled with the orders for one of my tables. The son saw the tray, and went straight for it, grabbing some wings off of the tray and knocking it out of my hands, making a huge mess. This was my last straw, and I told the woman that she needed to leave, and that she could not come in here with her son anymore, before removing myself from the situation to go clean sause off of my uniform. There was a bit of a scene, and then my manager ushered her out. So? Was I the asshole? Also idk if it matters, but I am M (20)
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> I believe that I may be an asshole or come off as ableist for kicking a woman out because of her son’s disruptive actions, which cannot be fully controlled.
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Contest mode is 1.5 hours long on this post.
NTA.
The mom is enabling his behavior and he probably doesn’t want to be there. I’ve worked in several households with the enabling mom of autistic son dynamic.
NTA – But this is an issue for your manager to handle, because these behaviors are directly impacting other patrons.
NTA, most places don’t allow people to bring their children to work.
Nobody wants random people touching their food. Mom should have been charged for those meals since they obviously couldn’t be served.
No. She hasn’t worked with him on his behavior. You have to put in the work to get any sort of improvement. I’ve met a number of autistic people and I am officially diagnosed as one. Generally I find that we are more than willing to learn if you are willing to teach. I won’t say it’s easy. It’s not. It’s not for any party involved, but it’s more than possible.
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NTAH
Your frustration is understandable. You’re a server, not a babysitter, and you can’t do your job properly if someone’s child is actively interfering with your work and hygiene standards.
I’m not gonna judge this person’s parenting, what she has or has not tried is unknown.
You are NTA. You don’t have to judge this stranger’s parenting to say that she and her son are disrupting this place of business.
She has a job to do and she needs to figure out something to do with her son.
How long is she in the restaurant? Can he stay in the car?
Do you have the authority to ban her?
I suggest that your manager contacts Door Dash and let them know that their contractor is causing a disruption in the restaurants she is providing services to
NTA. She needs to control him from not destroying your store.
NTA. You weren’t being discriminatory. It is your job to make sure food is handled safely, and you did your job.
NTA. Her kid is stealing other people’s food. That would get anyone, anywhere kicked out, austitic or not.
NTA for kicking them out but you have no idea if those actions “would be easily avoidable with discipline.” There are definitely autistic people for whom they are not.
NTA – Being non verbal austistic doesn’t give the child license to misbehave. A friend of mine has a non-verbal austistic child and the child gets disiplined if he does something he’s not supposed to. Most of those kids are pretty smart. Just because, for whatever reason, they can’t speak doesn’t mean they are stupid or unaware of what they are doing and some can be quite manipulative, using their disability as an advantage. Seen it happen first hand.
NTA. Who paid for the ruined food? Even nonverbal folks can be taught not to grab.
No you done nothing wrong good to see you really tried to have patience all them times, truly this was and is her the mothers problem which she has much teaching to give her son. I have been caring for my nephew for Thirty years, oh it has not been easy but never to a point as this you have, my nephew is very calm listen to much never acted out except when hearing children crying guess very concerned why, he’s non verbal so his reactions were where he start to get upset but it turned into a small start of a seizure when starting I calmly took his reaction held his arms said it’s okay it’s okay they are not being hurt mommy just walk away but she back so he settled right down and was happy. This still takes place but very rare so I try to keep him from large crowd gathering unless family. That lady should check into a summer school for him or respite care while she’s working state helps pay for that. Hard thing those waiting on their food now is a lot longer, hope she said sorry, but you all done right, she really needs to teach him.
best case scenario she would come in, stand aside or sit down out of the way WITH him,(holding his hand)& staying on top of his behavior, this is NOT that.
this is NOT an “Autism Problem”, this is a lack of parenting problem. He has violated health codes & created disturbances in the restaurant. wonder what DD would think of her doing all this in their employ.
NTA
this might be unpopular but soft YTA, not for getting frustrated with the events or how the boy is acting, you are 100% allowed to be annoyed, but for how you later in this post assume weather or not something can be “easily avoidable with discipline.”
It is unfortunately very common for parents of autistic children to be blamed for their children behaving badly, especially so with high support needs children (which it sounds like he is). As you may or may not know autistic children often behave in patterns, this doesn’t only mean that they follow schedules or wear the same clothes every day, it can also mean that they do similar things. In this case I think what is happening is that he is used to be allowed to eat food that is put on a plate at home, so when he is out and sees food on a plate he thinks its okay to eat from it. He may not understand that the food he was taking wasn’t for him to eat. Same thing with the lemon. And this is not something that can be easily fixed by his mom, it is a very common issue and can take a very long time to change. In fact parents are often advised (or used to be in the past at the least) that you shouldn’t punish your child for things like this, since they are not intentionally causing harm or being mean, and yelling at them can make them very confused since they don’t understand why, and can make fixing the issue much harder. This is not to justify her later behavior just to explain why the things may have happened in the first place. Also take it with a grain of salt since I obviously wasn’t there so I may be wrong.
Again, it is perfectly okay for you to be frustrated by the things you had to endure, and it really sucks. It is not something you just have to endure silently, and asking her to leave was definitely the best course of action. However it is not up to us to judge weather or not the mom is doing a good job handling a very complicated disability, or what type of discipline would help. Especially since we don’t know how much support she has at home
BTW she is 100% in the wrong for making a scene and needing to be thrown out by the manager, and also for not apologizing for his actions to begin with, her son might be disabled and need some extra grace, but she is not, and should not be acting like that! Sucks that you had to go through that.
NTA, although I don’t feel there is a lot of disciplining that can be effective with these type of individuals. I do believe the mother knew of the issues that could happen with this behavior and understood that even if everyone else was “understanding” she also needed to be understanding that although her son is autistic, it didn’t excuse him or her.
NTA – That lemon thing is a health code issue. Telling someone no to touching food that’s not there’s is perfectly okay. I think if the son can’t control his behavior enough to behave for a few minutes in a restaurant, there’s a bigger issue. He should NOT be grabbing at things that aren’t his and shouldn’t be touching food that’s not his either.
You should have said something about touching things to her and also polite tell the son that’s not okay to touch unless you have a server touch it. While she is the parent, i would tell a child no but nicely. If a child is playing in an isle in a resturant, i’d say “Hey, you can’t play there! I don’t want you to get hurt.” Be nice but that’s perfectly okay. If they parent yells at you, i’d just say – i couldn’t see you in the moment and you weren’t mean.
I would HAVE said something to the mother like “This behavior is not okay and that if it happens again, you won’t be welcome.”
She does not make any effort to control child. Her child = her problem
You did good.
That was very nasty to do that was not of any hygiene standard for an adult to do. Hope the rest of your work days go better.
Discipline doesn’t always work for autistics so yeah you’re the AH. If she uses your establishment, you might get fired. Shalom you’re loved 💔
ESH, I understand why you asked mom to leave but you do suck for judging her parenting. There’s a high likelihood that she has to bring her autistic teenage son with her during DoorDash deliveries because she literally has no other choice.
The mom may be between a rock and a hard place…
She has to work and delivery is the only job where she can take him along…affordable care is not really there for many of us.
That being said…he is old enough to stay in the car? Buckled in for the 1 minute She is grabbing an order? Does that sound reasonable at all?
NTA
Shes not correcting disruptive behaviors.
NTA. It’s ok to let someone know that their behavior or their custody’s behavior is problematic or disruptive or unsafe. Sounds like you did your best to be polite, and that’s all we can do sometimes.
Next time ask yourself, would I have done the same thing if it was someone without a disability? The answer is yes. You can’t have random people grabbing food in a restaurant. It’s a health and safety concern. NTA.
INFO: Have you tried addressing the issue with when he does things that violate health and safety codes for you guys before? Or have you been holding your tongue about it up until now?
NTA. If you know your child has a disability that extreme, you need to hold his hands or leave him home or something. She cant expect society to be okay with this behavior. I feel bad for the kid. One day someone will get too angry at him.
NTA the kid was overstimulated and she should have had him wait in the car since she’s picking up really quickly and leaving.
NTA. I’m sure she is door dashing and bringing her son along because she has no other choice. However, she should be able to discipline him to some extent so that he isn’t borderline abusive to people.
Scene? The manager could have, and should have, IMHO, charged the DoorDasher for every bit of product the kid wasted, or stole in a certain light.
NTA Non verbal does not mean stupid and she can teach him but she hasn’t bothered
If Helen Keller can learn, so can that boy
NTA – My son is autistic and was non-verbal until somewhat recently (he still has a lot of work to go, but he’s getting so much better. He’s been getting help and now has a communication device where he can type or press buttons, and it will speak for him). ANYWAY, I know kids are all different and can be on different levels of the spectrum, but he does not act like that. If he does act out (and he can at times), he gets disciplined right away, depending on the severity of what he did. If he EVER acted like that while I was doing an order? I’d avoid taking him with me and try to find a sitter. If that’s not possible, she needs to start being firm and disciplining him, or she won’t be welcome at many restaurants, I can’t imagine, and may lose her job as a DoorDasher.
TLDR; I have a nonverbal autistic 8 year old who doesn’t act like that. She’s in the wrong for bringing him or not disciplining him. You are not.
NTA. I’m autistic and there is a medium [needs, function, whatever term is acceptable] young person in the family. This person is not allowed to cause trouble like this, and if they try to, they get escorted out.
NTAH
I feel for the woman…but she has to find an alternate solution
I hesitate to wonder why the teenager could not be left in the car while she runs in and grabs food. Child safety locks exist.
Again…everyone understands this is a no win for this woman. But I mean she has to realize this is unsustainable
NTA
Lots to unpack here. Good on you for introspection and inquiry.
My .02 cents is a little different than others, because I have experience and perspective based on parenting autistic children.
YTA for specifically blaming autism, rather than calling out the behavior, at the top of the broadcast. This would be a problem even if the kid were not autistic. Bringing behaviors into the mix that you deem as not problematic paints the picture that you are in fact viewing autism as the problem, which is ableist, rather than focusing on incidents that happened that are true health and safety issues that need to be addressed. It just smacks of underlying judgment to me.
YTA for assuming that working with people of all abilities makes you non-ableist. That’s like saying you can’t be racist because you have a black friend.
Most of all, YTA for causing a scene the first time you address this ongoing behavior.
NTA for upholding health and safety at your place of business.
Here is how you could make improvements in the future:
Next time, don’t make assumptions about what should or should not be easy for a parent of a disabled child. Talk to the parent and set boundaries from the beginning.
Those boundaries can look like, “it’s not sanitary to touch the lemons with bare hands, and I have to throw out this whole batch because your son put one in his mouth and then put it back. He is welcome to sit at a table when you come to grab food, but we can’t have non-personnel in the food area.” Etc.
And then, if/when it happens again, remind the mom and escalate to the manager as a health and safety issue, and if it continues happening after that, report to grubhub or whoever, and if it happens after that, discuss with the manager about not allowing food runners to bring additional people on their food runs.
Being non-communicative and “patient” with people until you explode (or have a last straw) is AH behavior. You’re young, so this is an amazing time to choose a better path! I recommend learning to communicate boundaries and frustrations in the moment, before an escalation occurs.
(I edited my comment to clarify a couple of things)
NTA. I don’t blame the son as much as the parent, of course.
But on a more general note… there is never an excuse for being an asshole. We can and should understand circumstances and context, and judge more or less harshly as a result, but whether you are severely autistic or anything else, it is never okay to be an asshole to act like a dick for no reason.
Too often, and on this sub in particular (naturally, given the topic), there is a tendency to see a mitigating condition in someone’s circumstance and act like that is an impervious shield for criticism. The 14 year old in this story needs to know that it isn’t okay to grab someone else’s food, and certainly not in the unsanitary manner he does. “Autism” is not code for “you can do whatever you want and everyone else has to sit there and take it.” It just means that we should all extend a little more understanding and patience for transgressions, not that we need to condone them.
It sounds like he’s a legitimate hazard. If you hadn’t noticed the contaminated lemons and served them that would really bad. And knocking stuff of a tray isnt acceptable behavior for public. If he can’t act reasonably within societal norms then he belongs in a secure facility designed to cope with his needs if he isnt capable of learning.
Both assholes
A disability is not an excuse to be a health hazard or disrupt your work place.
NTA – being autistic doesn’t (or shouldn’t) excuse anyone from all wrong doing. As you mentioned, some behaviors are fine, disruptive but not harmful. I would only say Y T A if you had kicked her out for him clapping or making noises, but that’s not why. He made a massive mess, delayed another customer’s order, and contaminated a container of prepped lemons. Those actions, while likely caused by his autism, are ultimately due to a lack of parenting. She did not make any attempts to correct him either time. Autism should not be used to excuse everything a person does, while it’s always the reason, it does not make all of their actions excusable.
NTA – that’s insane.
ESH, YTA for your stance on this kid who clearly has severe autism and requires 24/7 care
> her non-verbal autistic son, probably around 13-14 years old, and almost every time she comes in, he causes some sort of disruption, usually clapping loudly or yelling, but that’s okay, I understand that as a parent you can’t really control that. However, he also causes issues that would be easily avoidable, with discipline
All that disruption makes it clear that the child is profoundly autistic and discipline isn’t going to work like it would for a non autistic or mildly autistic child. I get that people think oh if you grab that kid take the lemon away shout at him he’ll understand…. It’s pretty unlikely that’s how it would go down, he’d probably have a meltdown and cause a lot more disruption due to not understanding the problem and adding stress.
But it’s not right to take someone to your work with you when they carry those risks.
NTA.
The making noise and clapping may be unavoidable, but stealing food and tossing the tray probably is a parenting issue.
That said, you may have overstepped a bit. Was your manager aware of her son’s disruptive behaviors before this? Now that they are aware, what are they planning to do? This may be something that needs to be addressed between your manager(s) and DoorDash.
Are those delivery drivers even allowed to have passengers?
Definitely NTA, autism is not an excuse for uncivilized behavior
NTA – If he is unable to act appropriately in your place of work, then she shouldn’t bring him in. He could really hurt someone. In your case, you could have gotten burned. Are you supposed to allow him to put a chewed lemon back in the container??? NTA
My son is a nonverbal adult with level three autism, an intellectual disability, and a host of other challenges, so I feel like I have a pretty good understanding of this situation.
What this lady is trying to do is HARD. The level of stress she’s likely under, trying to work while having to bring her son and manage him, is immeasurable. I have SO MUCH compassion and grace for this mom.
What OP is doing is HARD. Restaurant work is freaking stressful and difficult and loaded with laws and regulations that help us all stay safe and healthy.
If the son did this type of thing once, and she corrected him (to the best of his understanding) and apologized, that would make sense. But as a repeated issue, it’s bananas. Wildly inconsiderate, rude, and unacceptable.
This woman needs to either find childcare (which she likely cannot afford even if she can find acceptable care) or start leaving her son safely in the car for those few minutes.
Perhaps OP could try something like this:
“Hey, (Mom). The last few times you’ve been in with your son, he has caused some issues that created expenses and health and safety issues for us. We see how hard you’re trying, and we would like to help. How about when you’re dashing, you (call/text/etc) and let us know who you’re picking up for. We will run the order out to you so you can wait in the car with your son. Would that make things easier on you guys? I can’t promise we will always be able to, but if we can, we would sure like to help.”
This makes the issue about helping her, not shaming either of them. It’s gracious, gets the job done, and is no more time consuming than cleaning up whatever happens when he’s in your restaurant.
It’s not your responsibility, but it is the kind thing to do and it helps everyone.
I have an autistic son. Things like this happen but I will try to stop him, apologize, replace, etc. NTA.
Anyone who has to assure you they aren’t -ist is usually -ist as hell.
NTA because this sounds like it could be dangerous. You should drop the judgement though. She can’t discipline these behaviors in public because of the chance of escalation .I’m in the same situation with my disabled child, the difference is I would never attempt to door dash with her. Never. It would be insanely stressful and dangerous. I’m betting she is in a desperate state financially and has no childcare for him because let’s face – it’s insanely hard to find qualified help for our kids .
NTA, but there are a lot of naive potential AH in these comments. It’s very obvious many have not worked with or spent time around people with level 3 ASD. This isn’t entirely a discipline problem or a “he needs to learn” issue.
What you have described is banning/trespassing a disruptive parent. She’s ultimately responsible for him, doesn’t seem to grasp that what she is allowing is affecting a business, and refuses to take any steps to correct it.
NTA. My 14 yo son is nonverbal with profound autism. He understands 100% of what is said & done around him. The issue he struggles with is impulse control – so yes if he wanted to take a lemon he saw on the bar or some food off a server’s tray, he’ll do it because he cannot control the impulse/his body reaching for/taking those things. Enter me, mom. I am responsible for making sure he is not able to reach for/take things that don’t belong to him when we are out in public. It’s 100% on the mom to watch her child & prevent him from being disruptive because her child has a disability that requires constant supervision.
My sister was high on the spectrum. But that was never an excuse for bad behavior. She could not grasp the concept of what was right or understand how to act correctly. BUT she could be trained. She knew certain actions (stealing was her favorite) would result in punishment like taking away a favorite toy, no TV, early bedtime, etc. When she acted up in a restaurant or store, she was immediately removed. Even though she didn’t know why… she knew never touch other people’s belongings because there were undesirable consequences. Even though she didn’t understand it all, she knew to walk properly next to one of us and be (mostly) “ladylike” if she wanted to go with us.
It has always bothered me that some people care more for their pets than their mentally challenged child. They will spend time and money training their dog and do everything they can to make it behave so it is liked by other people. Yet they let their disabled child become feral.
Lazy parent
The mother can control her son, mentally disabled or not. People let their children do anything they want at home, and it transfers over to public settings. I am a firm believer in, if your child acts an ass in my space, I’m going to have you all removed. Your kids are special little snowflakes to you only, the rest of us do not have to accommodate their bad behavior. The mother was raised without manners and class, so she’s sadly repeating the cycle and excusing it because he’s disabled. He can do that with your food at your own house, but not with other people’s in public.
Sounds more like a parent problem than autism
Grabbing cut fruit, eating it and putting it back in the holder? That’s a violation of health codes. Grabbing food from a tray that a server is holding? Not just a health violation but a safety issue for guests and workers. NTA. She can take up her issues with management.
Ok, if he’s touching food and being unsanitary IN the restaurant, I wonder what he’s doing to people’s food when they’re in the car. Like, is he licking people’s French fries or something?
I don’t know how DoorDash handles this stuff, and you can’t prove anything that happens out of your sight, but I would not want this person delivering my food. Could your manager call DD and express their concerns? He could potentially be endangering people’s health.
Kinda torn, but I think I have to say NTA.
Parent of two austic kids / late diagnosed autistic adult here. My kids are much younger than the one in the story, but I know my youngest is likely to get riled up in stores/restaurants due to overstimulation. It’s crowded, it’s loud, probably bright, and somewhere out of his comfort zone. Course correction is extremely unlikely to work once he’s overstimulated and past the point of no return. We take measures to prevent this (noise canceling headphones, snacks, not going out during peak busy times if it can be avoided) but there are times when that’s not enough and I’m carrying a kicking, screeching kid out with everyone staring.
I feel for the mom because it is challenging. Would it be possible to have a conversation with her and set expectations (hey, it’s great to see you and your son when you do pickups and we’re happy to have you stop in. We can’t have anyone touching food, it’s a safety concern and really need all of our drivers to be mindful of this. Maybe we could come up with a strategy together to make this process smoother). I know all of this seems blatant common sense or that she’s just not parenting, but it very well may be not that simple. It’s possible the kid can get destructive or self injurious with meltdowns and she’s trying to just get in and out. If he was just a little noisy for a minute, I’d say just give them some grace. Snatching food is another story though. It’s then wasted product, wasted time for the kitchen who needs to make more and for the person who needs a meal remade, and it’s dangerous.
>Last week, the she came in with him, grabbed a lemon out of our lemon holder (the lemons for the drinks), put it in his mouth, and then placed it back in the holder with the rest of the lemons.
That’s disgusting. Why would she even think that is remotely acceptable?
NTA – You can’t just have someone running around, causing a mess, tainting food etc. regardless of whether or not they have a disability.