Read it this morning here
And wondering what thoughts others might have. The author sites several studies supporting the idea that married women with children are, in fact, happier. And I’m…suspicious.
Read it this morning here
And wondering what thoughts others might have. The author sites several studies supporting the idea that married women with children are, in fact, happier. And I’m…suspicious.
Comments
I personally am interested in the truth. Whether that be uncomfortable or not
Of course a study out of BYU says married with children women are the happiest. A organization that pushes heavily patriarchal ideals and who heavily focuses on procreation says marriage and procreation make women happy.
On a more serious note, it’s important to realize no matter what studies like this say, that doesn’t mean how your life is or how you feel is wrong.
You are a piece of data, not a whole statistic. If you feel differently from the finding that’s okay, if you don’t feel differently from the finding that’s okay too. No study can tell you how you should feel about your situation.
What’s not cool and what I don’t love about this study is that it’s being held up by some as a “see women need to get hitched and have kids and it doesn’t actually suck” or a gotcha. Especially considering the source of the study and the fact there has been a trend in media that heavily promotes having kids, even when metrics for health and safety measures for women show things are getting worse.
I think The Atlantic is known for being conservative, but covertly so.
I could be wrong.
It’s possible. I don’t know if I’m happier or not than most married women with children. I’m not happy financially, which bleeds into a lot of things and I don’t have a clear solution to that and I don’t own property and I’m not terribly happy with my career. I know women who were married and they had kids and got a divorce or the husband passed away and they didn’t date after because they were happy without it. Could they be happier than I am? Probably. They probably ended up with a home fully paid that was partially paid by the husband. I know I can’t afford a home on my own. I personally do not see myself reflected in a lot of these kinds of studies. Not sure who their demographic of women were who they surveyed. Was it certain type of single white women who made a certain amount financially who had a certain level of education who didn’t have any trauma in their lives to work through and have a healthy network of friendships and own their own property and are actually happy with their careers? I know someone who is married with a child and they exude genuine happiness. Take these studies with a grain of salt I guess.
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There’s at least one organization that literally pays media companies to publish pro-marriage/traditional family content. You can’t know for sure if the article is that or not but I always assume it is – especially when the article has a spin to it or is basically grasping at straws.
Edit: I actually just read most of his article and I think the author (if not also the publication) is getting paid extra just to create pro-marriage/children content. There’s no nuances of examining the case for/against – it’s just saying that mothers self report a sense of meaning in their lives and married mothers may be happier and that may be related to easier access to physical touch. The author even mentions how her life has the greatest sense of meaning from nurturing children even though she also has a “fulfilling career”. It’s just so overly positive – I think this is a prime example of that paid content.
I also think the Washington Post editorial board – when they supposedly got together to say that young women and men should try to visit each other the benefit of the doubt about political beliefs and dating. I think that was heavily influenced by these pro-marriage groups.
I don’t think tracking which demographic is happiest is a particular meaningful exercise. Some women want to be married and/or have children, some don’t. It’s possible that many of the single, childless women are less happy because they want to be married with kids. That doesn’t mean that a woman who doesn’t want to be married or have kids would be happier being married with kids. It’s also quite likely that there are confounding factors, e.g. being poor makes it less likely to be married or to be very happy, but the cause of unhappiness is poverty.
ETA: Here’s an article that expresses similar concerns.
I refuse to believe any studies about happiness in women that comes from a University founded by a religion that explicitly tells women that they need to look and be happy all the time.
They basically blame unhappy-looking people for their low recruitment numbers.
OF COURSE every momo is going to answer that they are happier married! They’re FINALLY allowed to fuck!
The single woman are the happiest all stemmed from a book Happy Ever After by Paul Dolan which was erroneous.
““Married people are happier than other population subgroups, but only when their spouse is in the room when they’re asked how happy they are. When the spouse is not present: f***ing miserable,” Dolan said, citing the American Time Use Survey, a national survey available from the Bureau of Labor Statistics and used for academic research on how Americans live their lives.
The problem? That finding is the result of a grievous misunderstanding on Dolan’s part of how the American Time Use Survey works. The people conducting the survey didn’t ask married people how happy they were, shoo their spouses out of the room, and then ask again. Dolan had misinterpreted one of the categories in the survey, “spouse absent,” which refers to married people whose partner is no longer living in their household, as meaning the spouse stepped out of the room.”
Vox: https://www.vox.com/future-perfect/2019/6/4/18650969/married-women-miserable-fake-paul-dolan-happiness
Paywall bypass link: A new book says married women are miserable. Don’t believe it. | Vox
I think it’s a waste of time and energy to try and figure out who’s “happiest” in general terms
people who have what they want in life tend to be happiest
single, childless women who always wanted a spouse and children of their own are probably going to be unhappy in some ways. you’ll find no greater group of anxious, unhappy people than at a fertility clinic (ask me how I know.)
but married mothers who had to give up the careers they dreamed of because they got pregnant before they’d achieved their goals are also going to have a degree of unhappiness. a lot of women in that situation feel like they’ve forfeited their lives to their kids, and that their only identity is “mom.”
both of those groups of women will be able to derive happiness and fulfillment in their situations as well, some more than others. but on average they’re going to be less happy than people who are living the lives they wanted in terms of their family structure (or lack thereof)
What is even the point of this study, and any study like it? Women are not a monolith. We are as individual in our needs and desires and abilities and advantages as the human spectrum will allow. Some women will be happiest being married with a couple of kids, some will even desire a lot of kids, some will be happy married but childfree, some will treasure the solitude and freedom of remaining single.
In this bizarro timeline, I have to suspect that we’ll see more ‘studies’ coming to the same conclusion and being used as another cog in the ‘re-enslave women’ machine, which is equal parts brainwashing and force.
Got a little ranty there. But yeah, it doesn’t matter what a study says makes ‘most’ women happier, that’s got nothing to do with us as individuals, as long as we have choices.
The study and report including methodology is here
It was funded by the IFL who also, interestingly, has initiatives called, “Get Married Initiative” and “Pronatalism Initiative.” 🤮
The mission of the Institute for Family Studies (IFS) is to strengthen marriage and family life and advance the welfare of children through research and public education. Known for its objective and incisive studies that attract attention and respect from across the ideological spectrum, the Institute’s programs and platforms focus on marriage, child well-being, family formation, parenting, and the role of technology in family life.
Then the work was performed by the Wheatley Institute at BYU who’s goal is:
Strengthening society through research-supported work that fortifies the core institutions of family, religion, and constitutional government.
Their methodology seems okay overall, but in general, “opt-in” surveys lack ability to garner people who have less free-time to answer questionnaires, and it looks like that means they weighted the fewer single mom responses more heavily.
Additionally, “well-being” and other types of subjective questions are really hard to measure. For instance, “well-being” may be measured by questions relating to financial security (and I do believe married couples have generally more financial security, though childless couples probably rank highest).
It’s paywalled 🙁
Do they clarify whether they are working or stay-at-home married mothers?
The research I have read so far is that people without kids are happier, but parents sense a greater meaning in life. I think those two concepts are not the same.
I have kids (three!) and I really feel the ”meaning in life” part, and I feel the absence of the type of happiness I had before kids. There is just less time and more stress, as well as more responsibility and more worry.
To be honest I’m getting sick of people online spreading this idea. People who want marriage and kids will be the happiest if they have that. People who want to be single and child free will be happy being childfree and single. Also I’m sorry I might be downvoted for this idc but it’s also okay to be a bit said if you want marriage and kids but it hasn’t happened for you. It’s not black or white .
Version without a paywall?
Didn’t the OG study show that women with kids and supportive husbands are the happiest group, but women without kids were much happier than women with kids and unhelpful husbands?
And the group of women with kids and good husbands was the smallest group. So much so that “on average,” a woman was more likely to be single, childless, and happy than she was to be married, have kids, and be happy.
At least, from what I recall.
But the people who don’t like those results just point to the first line and claim that’s proof that women are happier if they’re married with kids.
Mormon propaganda 🤨
The Atlantic over here doing the bidding for their masters.
It’s the Atlantic, they’re about as trustworthy as OAN.
Women are happiest living the lives they choose and want for themselves. For the answers you seek, look within. No study or article can tell you if you truly want to raise a child or be legally tied to a spouse. Only you can.
The part where the author says this idea (that single women without children are happier) is the main drive behind plummeting birth rates gives it all away. She says Gen Z are just pessimistic, too. Gee, I wonder why? All the people who ignore the high costs of living and the climate crisis when talking about birth rates are fundamentally disingenuous and dishonest.
ETA the bit I’m talking about: “The false narrative that marriage and motherhood are a recipe for women’s unhappiness is doing a lot of damage. In a nationally representative survey that I analyzed for my book Generations, the number of 18-year-old women who expected to have children plummeted by 11 percentage points from the late 2000s to the early 2020s. Negative messaging about marriage and motherhood is likely at the root of these Gen Z shifts, along with a pervasive pessimism about everything, egged on by social media, that borders on doomerism.”
Of course Emily Oster’s safe space has an agenda. 🙂
Makes sense, that’s when I was happiest.
Sus
There could certainly be days when this was true.
The Atlantic is a conservative rag.
I always thought alkoholic fins where the happiest demograpic
This is definitely propaganda because:
It is the product of Brad Wilcox, a known Pro-Marriage lobbyist.
The article uses the plural “children” and those of us who are “one and done” know that moms with multiples are overwhelmed. Especially if they also work outside the home and are expected to be financial co-providers. There’s even a term for it too, “Rushing Woman’s Syndrome.”
An alarming amount of mothers in America are on some type of antidepressants, so take that happiness claim for what it’s worth.
The article’s strongest argument? That single women are more “touch starved.” Now, they may have a point here, but I think it’s largely due to women not forming close community with each other. After all, never in human history have women, partnered or not, been so isolated from each other.
People today rely way too much on their spouses to fulfill their social needs. We aren’t wired for this.
And it goes on to take a dig at women with AI boyfriends, which is hilarious because a good percentage of the women over there in r/MyBoyfriendIsAI are married.
Bottom line? They’re really freaking out about women choosing to remain unmarried and childfree. The truth of the matter is that we are living in unprecedented times and as a mom of one who enjoys motherhood so much that I’ve homeschooled, the vast majority aren’t up for the demanding challenge of mothering.
That’s my sort of nice way of saying that people choosing to be childfree seem to instinctively know that they would not be good at it in this “no village” western society.
Read about this earlier today. Study was done at BYU which is owned by the Mormon church. Ofc they’re gonna say having babies is great.