Im so disheartened when I realise a man’s friendliness correlates to how romantically or sexually available i am, or how attractive they find me.
I’m 23F. I started a job a month ago that I was really happy to get- making pizzas at a trendy restaurant chain in my city. The people they hire are usually alternative people, which fits me perfectly.
I’ve been building up a really good rapport with everyone, until something familiar happened tonight, which is that with another woman there, who they were attracted to, I became invisible and unimportant to them.
It hurts me because I thought we got on for people’s sake. It hurts to realise the most important aspect of my personality to them is if they think I’m attractive or not.
How do you cope? It’s made me lose respect for said people. I won’t be able to be open to them like I was before, I feel. Mostly out of respect for myself and my own feelings.
I feel so done with being a woman and everything that comes along with this in so many ways.
Im so tired of being quantified based on my aesthetics and not my content of person. I’m so tired.
Comments
Login here to leave a comment
I’m invisible to everyone male or female most of the time. You sorta get used to it…kinda
I’ll gently suggest maybe it’s simply someone else walking in the room? Like if I’m talking to someone, and then a third person enters the room, naturally my attention might shift to that third person.
Start decentering men. If they mess up or inconvenience you while doing your job, call them out. They’ll either respect you or show their true colors, either way you win
Is it really that big of a deal? Your friends were attracted to someone and focused on her. In the meanwhile you were invisible to them, and they were invisible to each other too. That’s what happens when there is an exceptionally attractive person around that people want to talk to and impress. That’s what happens between platonic friends, we’re not always the center of attention in each other’s lives, we can’t expect that kind of undivided attention and adoration in platonic friendships, but that doesn’t mean they don’t like you. They probably like you a lot, respect you and have fun hanging out with you. But I mean come on, imagine some super hot person who is totally your type, wouldn’t you pay more attention to that person for a while than you would to your same old friends that you see everyday? That’s how people are, we’re all a little dumb and shallow and have short attention spans lol.
Just wait until you reach the age, late 50s for me, when you’re invisible to most men you know casually. It is disheartening.
In this case I wouldn’t see it so much about you as about their lack of focus control – if you will – in that they aren’t overriding their hormone reaction. Not all people of any gender do this. You’ll find your own way to handle this, whether it’s to quietly leave, to bring the conversation back to the work topic with a pointed comment or some other tactic that works for you.
You’re only 23 but already so tired. I hate that for you, and I wish it wasn’t so. But also love that for you, that you’re seeing things – seeing the injustice and misogyny, at a young age. Which hopefully will mean you can watch out better than us older ones that didn’t see clearly until much later in life. I don’t think I started to get tired until I was in my 30’s, which says a lot about what a pick me I was in my younger years.
The way I cope? Centering women. Decentering men. I have a few trusted ones in my family yes, and I can like men (such as my work colleagues or my friends’ boyfriends) as individual human beings, but I also protect my mind. I don’t expect anything from them anymore. And I don’t give them anything anymore either. I don’t date anymore, my peace is more important. My friends are overwhelmingly female (not because I refuse to befriend men, but because they have all ended up being a lame excuse for people in the end). I find my circle, my solace and my strength in the incredible women that are all around.
Saying this as someone who felt like a constant ugly duckling in her 20s, I promise you it gets better.
I had a really incredibly attractive friend in my 20s. So much so that I was “her ugly friend” and she was “my hot friend.” Everywhere we went together, I was invisible. Men would come up and beg for her number and not even acknowledge me. After years of this, it kind of gave me a complex that in order to be liked, you had to be “attractive.” I thought dating and friendships were all a game with hot people as the only winners.
Your 20s are about becoming who you’ll be for the rest of your life. I hope you can avoid the pitfall I fell victim to of pinning my self worth on my looks and comparing every aspect of myself to other women. It’s an easy way for jealousy and self loathing to rule your life. And the guys who always chased my friend instead of me, were, in hindsight, just gross. Classic fuckboys that really only wanted a lay. In my experience if they’re only talking to you when the “hot girl” isn’t on shift, then they are fuckboys and not worth a solid investment anyway.
So how do you cope? Honestly please start with loving yourself, physically and spiritually. You are beautiful and worthy of love and affection. What are your dreams? What motivates you? What kind of life do you want to build? Make your life about chasing those answers. The people who are true friends and love you for more than looks will out themselves. You are more than how you look. I hope that experience didn’t hurt you too deeply and that you are kind to yourself if you ever feel like this again.
I’m just happy to lose respect for them and make space for better people. I don’t give those people a second thought.
Happened to me too. Thought my husband’s friends liked me as a person. Until a woman who flirted with them all came along and I was dirt to them.
I mean first off that their like of me was based off of my availability when IM MARRIED TO THEIR FRIEND is disgusting!!
Then there’s just the blatant disrespect. They saw me as dirt after. Like I wasn’t even human..
Ever since then I don’t give most men anything. Not the time of day, not politeness not a second thought. If I’m not a person to them they’re not people to me.
Do your job and stop needing men to validate you while at work.
they are not worth your time.
Also you work to get paid and go home. Make friends outside work and develop a social system outside work.
Kitchens tend to be boys’ locker rooms without the lockers. I see you’ve said that they typically hire “alt people” but look — 1 month in and you see how they operate
Some of the upfront disclaimers they used to give my wife before she’d start a new kitchen job were things like “if you’re gonna work here you gotta be able to dish it out AND take it” “you gotta be one of the boys” “people are gonna hump your leg here, if you’re not cool with that you probably shouldn’t work here” etc etc. She didnt see it as sexist at first, just “the way things are”, but once I pointed all this shit out to her she started realizing how dehumanizing the industry is and she won’t fuck with kitchens anymore (she can’t anyway, her health won’t permit it, but that’s a whole-ass other story of people [doctors] not caring about the women in front of them)
I can’t tell you how to navigate this but I can tell you that kitchens are the goddamned lions’ den for women just trying to make an honest living
Oh god I feel this dude. I have a boyfriend and am not attracted to or interested in my male coworkers at ALL. But I literally catch myself getting jealous sometimes when we work with other attractive women because I start feeling left out. They won’t talk to me as much or joke around with me as much as they usually do.
I just try not to let it get to me and I’ll stop trying to engage with them when I feel ignored. I’ll chat up my female coworkers instead and focus on socializing with them and not the boys. I work an unconventional job where I travel with a team so we spend a lot of time together. I get really bored with no one to talk to so I just bond with the women as much as I can. The boys I’ll still talk to and have fun with when they’re in the mood to do so, but I don’t expect anything from them. It does hurt my feelings still but luckily the women I work with feel the same way and we bond over it.
Look, that’s true to an extent. But if you’re reliant on your work culture and being noticed as a woman to feel good, then you’re reliant on it.
Yeah it sucks. But at the end of the day, you’re there to do a job, not make friends. Stop caring how people see you beyond that, and you’ll be a lot happier.
Focus your feelings outside work, because they clearly arent going to change just because of how you feel IN work.
Pick a hill to die on that you can actually fight on.
I say this as a 32 year old gay woman who’s dealt with men like this. I do friends outside work and keep it strictly professional at work.
Life’s easier that way.
This is when you flirt with the women customers and assert dominance.
Sounds like a glimpse into the man’s world. We are invisible for most part of our life
Yeah, I take notes on who treats me like this and, if they were a friend, I downgrade them to ‘acquaintance’. It sucks that so many men are like this; it’s important to keep the good ones close and minimize how much energy you spend on the less worthy ones. But, emotionally, it takes a toll on a person to be treated like that constantly.
I saw someone else call those guys ‘pick-mes”, and that is such a good name for it!
If it helps I’ll say this can happen to guys too but a lesser scale. When you are not the cook or “in” person people will often pass over you for the more exciting people. Very noticeable at times when you feel like you are almost being tolerated over respected.
It’s important to understand this is more of a them issues than anything about yourself. They want to interact with what’s exciting and shiny to them. Guys in particular are ridiculous around women they are attracted too. I’ve seen dudes ignore entire friend groups of women just to hyper focus on one and its weird.
When I worked with men, I just tried to be accepted as one of them. I’d purposely squash any attempts at flirting very quickly. I didn’t want them seeing me like that at all. I made sure I was respected, but we’d shoot the shit, crack jokes and talk about popular neutral topics. Especially working with younger crowds in food service/retail, it’s very different than working a professional environment, you can build a sense of camaraderie.
I could tell when they were interested in another female coworker but that didn’t make me invisible. And I didn’t want that attention. I was taken and male attention in that way isn’t all it’s cracked up to be.
Who cares about those guys?
You’ve heard older women say they’re invisible? What age it happened? Love it or hate it, women are invisible unless the man wants to f*ck them. That’s all.