TW: abuse, alcoholism
Names changed for privacy
My (25F) husband, Adam(28M), and I have been married for 2.5 years now and have an amazing relationship. We are strong communicators and while there’s not much we disagree on, when we DO disagree, we always speak to each other respectfully and do our best to understand the other’s perspective.
Now for some background:
My husband and his mom, June (55F), have had a strained relationship for over 10 years at this point. His parents divorced when he was pretty young and June picked some less than stellar partners since then. The worst was Jerry (?M). From what I understand, Jerry was VERY abusive toward June physically, mentally, and verbally, and pushed her to drink to excess. Jerry convinced June to move her family from the Midwest, to Texas, and finally to Oregon before things hit their breaking point. Adam (16ish at this point), his mom, Jerry, and 3 other family members were living in a 1 or 2 bedroom apartment and the abuse was peaking when Jerry told June that if Adam came to the apartment (after school or work or something) he would kill him.
With no other family in the area, Adam became homeless in Oregon for a few weeks until he was able to get in contact with grandparents who got him a ticket back home to the Midwest. From there he went on to get his GED and live with his dad/grandparents for a few years before moving out and working and eventually meeting me.
Adam told June they would not have contact as long as she was still in communication with Jerry. Over the years she left and returned to Jerry multiple times (understandable, as abusive relationships are hard to leave) but Adam always held his boundary firm. Shortly after we met June had moved back to the Midwest to live with her parents and get her life back together (and quit drinking) after leaving him for (what we thought would be) the final time. (ETA: From my understanding, after she moved back to the Midwest time they all had some sit-downs to try to work through it)
I encouraged Adam to rebuild his relationship with his mom, especially after we found out we were pregnant with our son. (ETA: He WANTED June to have a relationship with our son, and I helped him. It was not my idea). They were calling/messaging more often and June had somewhat of a place in our life. It was never great, but I was also actively messaging and sharing our life with her.
A few days ago, we received a message in his family’s group chat that they wanted to start moving the grandparents to their new house this weekend. We said we had to work, as well as some other family members, and Adam’s aunt followed up with a message along the lines of “guess June and Jerry are going to have to help!”
Followed by “June and who??” From Adam and then complete silence for a few minutes. Adam’s sister then revealed that June had never really stopped seeing Jerry and that they had been living together since June moved out from the grandparents’ house (~1 year ago).
To say we were livid is an understatement. Adam wants to go no contact again not for seeing Jerry the whole time, but for lying about it for so long, presumably to have a relationship with our son (2M). I’m 100% on board, but we still have to figure out what we want to do regarding holidays, etc.
June hadn’t seen the group chat by the time Adam and I made our decision, and while I wanted to immediately call and/or message her, he wanted to give her a chance to see it and reach out (which she has not done yet either).
No-contact is a given, and at this point nonnegotiable for the time being. But how should we go about it? What else should we do? Are we the assholes for depriving our son (and our future children) from a relationship with one of his grandmothers?
Thanks for letting me vent, even a couple days later I am shocked, hurt, and furious that I went to bat for this woman and she had the audacity to betray all of our trust.
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Backup of the post’s body: TW: abuse, alcoholism
Names changed for privacy
My (25F) husband, Adam(28M), and I have been married for 2.5 years now and have an amazing relationship. We are strong communicators and while there’s not much we disagree on, when we DO disagree, we always speak to each other respectfully and do our best to understand the other’s perspective.
Now for some background:
My husband and his mom, June (55F), have had a strained relationship for over 10 years at this point. His parents divorced when he was pretty young and June picked some less than stellar partners since then. The worst was Jerry (?M). From what I understand, Jerry was VERY abusive toward June physically, mentally, and verbally, and pushed her to drink to excess. Jerry convinced June to move her family from the Midwest, to Texas, and finally to Oregon before things hit their breaking point. Adam (16ish at this point), his mom, Jerry, and 3 other family members were living in a 1 or 2 bedroom apartment and the abuse was peaking when Jerry told June that if Adam came to the apartment (after school or work or something) he would kill him.
With no other family in the area, Adam became homeless in Oregon for a few weeks until he was able to get in contact with grandparents who got him a ticket back home to the Midwest. From there he went on to get his GED and live with his dad/grandparents for a few years before moving out and working and eventually meeting me.
Adam told June they would not have contact as long as she was still in communication with Jerry. Over the years she left and returned to Jerry multiple times (understandable, as abusive relationships are hard to leave) but Adam always held his boundary firm. Shortly after we met June had moved back to the Midwest to live with her parents and get her life back together (and quit drinking) after leaving him for (what we thought would be) the final time.
I encouraged Adam to rebuild his relationship with his mom, especially after we found out we were pregnant with our son. They were calling/messaging more often and June had somewhat of a place in our life. It was never great, but I was also actively messaging and sharing our life with her.
A few days ago, we received a message in his family’s group chat that they wanted to start moving the grandparents to their new house this weekend. We said we had to work, as well as some other family members, and Adam’s aunt followed up with a message along the lines of “guess June and Jerry are going to have to help!”
Followed by “June and who??” From Adam and then complete silence for a few minutes. Adam’s sister then revealed that June had never really stopped seeing Jerry and that they had been living together since June moved out from the grandparents’ house (~1 year ago).
To say we were livid is an understatement. Adam wants to go no contact again not for seeing Jerry the whole time, but for lying about it for so long, presumably to have a relationship with our son (2M). I’m 100% on board, but we still have to figure out what we es t to do regarding holidays, etc.
June hadn’t seen the group chat by the time Adam and I made our decision, and while I wanted to immediately call and/or message her, he wanted to give her a chance to see it and reach out (which she has not done yet either).
No-contact is a given, and at this point nonnegotiable for the time being. But how should we go about it? What else should we do? Are we the assholes for depriving our son (and our future children) from a relationship with one of his grandmothers?
Thanks for letting me vent, even a couple days later I am shocked, hurt, and furious that I went to bat for this woman and she had the audacity to betray all of our trust.
I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.
Nta. Just be honest. Let her know that she made her choice to be with Jerry and you will be protecting your family. Your children are not safe around them.You can call and say it over the phone or text her.
If any other family members say anything tell them you are no contact and do not want to hear anything about them. If someone mentions one of her names just say “I have drawn the line. Don’t mention them to me”.
I’m sorry she betrayed you but she knew what she was doing. Hope you find healing and peace with her not being in your life.
You guys are definitely not the assholes, and the choice to immediately go no contact is the right one. I can completely empathize with it being incredibly difficult to get out of an abusive relationship, but:
A) she’s had so much support and resources and she was OUT. The choice to undo all of that is devastating. It’s easy for me to say, but I truly don’t understand losing your child because your partner threatened them not being a breaking point for you…
And B) the betrayal of the lies and deception when she knew this was a boundary for you guys is the truly devastating part. She’s an adult who can make her own choices, but if she wanted to choose her abuser (again) over her child and grandchild, then she should have stood behind that decision and been honest.
As far as how to go about cutting contact, it’s up to him. If he would find it helpful to say some things to her before cutting her off, then he should. If he’d rather you guys block her and cut all contact immediately, she’ll obviously know why. If you need to sort out issues of family holidays where she may be there, I think a clear message to family saying that you will not be showing up when she’s there is all that’s needed. Be firm and don’t accept arguing or pleading with you for compromise.
As the peacemaker in the middle you might be tempted to try to hear everyone out, but the most important person in this is your husband and what he wants at this moment. So just focus on supporting and facilitating what he is most comfortable with.
I’m sorry you guys are dealing with this huge betrayal. How terrible.
I would go NC with no words being spoken to her. I would not waste the energy.
You are NTA for keeping your child away fro someone actively trapped in a cycle of abuse. Not to mention the abuser has physically threatened your spouse. What if this creep hurts your child to punish your husband for not falling in line.
I’m going to go against the grain here and say YTA. Not Adam, you. You have been encouraging him to have a relationship with his mother when she has proven time and time again that she is not a good mother. She will choose his abuser over him every time. Stop it. Stop trying to make up excuses for her. Even now you’re acting like this is something you really don’t want to do. Stop advocating for her. Stop giving her ways to continue to control and abuse your husband. Believe him when he tells you what they did and that he needs to go no contact. These people shouldn’t be around him or your child. Period.
Stand by your husband and his decision. You don’t need to ask strangers how to deal with his family when he’s told you how.
EDIT: Thanks for the award!
First off, you are NOT horrible people for depriving your son and future kids a relationship with his grandmother.
She has been lying the entire time about her relationship with Jerry. She may beg and grovel to see your son and future kids, but she made her bed and she can lay in it. You will NEVER be entirely sure that she will respect your boundaries and bring your kid(s) around him. If he threatened to hurt your husband, who at the time was a teenager, there’s no telling what he may do to a younger child especially if they’re still drinking.
Personally, I would be completely no-contact, only seeing her at family events unless Jerry is there. Any flying monkeys that pop up to try and shame and guilt you, or try to convince you go on either an immediate info diet, or stone wall them. No-contact with them if you feel they’re getting too much, your main focus should be your children.
Honestly I’m mind boggled you’d allow your child around her anyway? It’s not just on Jerry your husband was homeless and traumatised. She is just as much at fault. Anyone who treated their own child so cruelly would never have a place in my life.
There’s no point saying anything to her, she’s always going to be that person. You’d have better luck beating your head against a brick wall.
with all due respect you shouldn’t be contacting her at all.
she was perfectly ok with her son’s life being threatened and him becoming a homeless and alone minor in a place he isn’t so familiar with. she doesn’t deserve any relationship with your husband and kid.
honestly I’d leave it to your husband. he had warned you before and had a relationship with her for your sake. stop meddling.
You are not depriving your child of anything by preventing them from being around enablers of abuse. June has proven she won’t protect children (her own) from Jerry’s threats. She has shown she is a liar and hides the fact an abuser is still around.
Just flat out tell everyone what Jerry did and that June enabled him (abused or not jerked, she enabled the threats and the abuse) and that you will cut the cycle of abuse and will not bring your child around an abuser or an enabler.
Remember, this means you may have to cut out others who KNOW and don’t care about this history. I wouldn’t trust that side of the family alone with your kid.
Just ghost her. No need for wasted energy. She’ll get the hint.
You are protecting your child and HE is your priority.
You cannot and should not help June. She’s an adult. SHE LIED.
Jerry’s history proves he belongs NOWHERE NEAR your husband and your family!
Just ghost June. She doesn’t deserve the respect you’d give her by telling her yourself.
“I encouraged Adam to rebuild his relationship with his mom, especially after we found out we were pregnant with our son.“
If I had a penny for every ‘MIL created an unsafe disaster area with her choices/behavior’ that started with this I could probably retire and buy a private island with a security force to keep my own crappy dangerous mom at a distance (because once she sniffs out my plethora of pennies she’ll crawl out of the bottle long enough to make herself my problem again).
A grandbaby isn’t going to fix the problems with her that her own baby didn’t fix.
You messed up. You messed up bad. You need to look inward at why you felt compelled to create this problem for your family.
You are beyond the venting off the pressure of your enormous fuck up and “am I mean for slamming the door I opened” stage.
ETA: You need to go read in JustNoMIL. You made some really predictable and stereotypical missteps.
He needs to be in therapy and you need to be reading books and groups to learn the reality of what you’re dealing with is.
I’d never have a relationship with her to begin with. Any woman choosing some random dick to hop on rather than protecting her child is a vile POS
I’m really not quite understanding why you feel you are depriving your son from a relationship with his grandmother who is okay being with a guy that threatened to kill her son. I wouldn’t let that woman within 50 ft of my child. Not only is she a liar but she has made it quite clear that Jerry is way more important to her than her own son. Because what kind of a sick woman stays with a man who has threatened to kill her child. Please go no contact your son does not need a grandmother like this.
YTA for pushing him to have a relationship with her to begin with since it didn’t involve therapy for the both of them and for her to acknowledge her abuse towards him. She chose men over her child. That’s choosing to become an abusive parent.
You shouldn’t have been sharing anything with her! It was his relationship to manage.
You have a healthy dynamic with your family so you’ll never understand what that does to a child.
NTA for cutting contact now. Just block her from any social media and phones. She’s aware she was caught. She doesn’t care since she hasn’t even attempted to reach out.
You don’t owe her any explanations. She knows she was lying and didn’t care when it was eventually discovered. Because that definitely wasn’t going to be kept a secret forever.
Your husband needs to understand that she’s never going to be the mother he deserves and he’ll never have a good relationship with her because she only cares about herself.
Stop worrying about the potential holiday plans. Be firm with any family members who try to guilt or want to play peace makers too.
Because there’s quite a bit of them who seem to have known she was still in contact with Jerry and also living with him, and they chose to keep it from y’all.
Plan your own family holidays from now on and stay away from all of his family members who lied to you for the time being. They get put in time out.
You and your husband need to set some serious boundaries with his remaining family members who were aware. Because they’ll continue to lie to you about anything. So, I wouldn’t trust any of them with being alone my child at any point in the future.
You shouldn’t be too surprised that June lied and betrayed your trust. She sounds like a drunk who was fine with abusing and abandoning her child when she allowed her boyfriend to threaten a16yo and left him homeless.
Keep your child and any future children away from her!
Edit: forgot two words
I would go no contact. You’re not depriving your son of a relationship with his grandma. You’re keeping him from an unreliable person who will lie to you, doesn’t have your husband or sons safety in priority and would actively put him in danger. Big thing you missed is – how should you navigate the relationships with the aunt and others who knew, saw it happen, and kept quiet on it, intentionally keeping this secret?
Stop meddling. YTA for meddling in the first place.
Stop asking your husband questions about reconnecting with his mom. You said you followed your husband lead but the lead was there because your pointed questions.
Learn to stop nosing around inappropriately.
>”Are we the assholes for depriving our son (and our future children) from a relationship with one of his grandmothers?”
No, you’re not. She deprived herself of that relationship. She made her choice repeatedly. If she was willing to stay with a man who threatened to kill her son and abandoned her son to homelessness, she disqualified herself as a mother, let alone as a grandmother.
Honestly, I don’t even understand why you let her back in at all. A person who could tolerate that level of danger to their own child isn’t magically going to be a safe, trustworthy presence for your child.
If you allow her to continue being involved, that’s not protecting your son; that’s putting him at risk emotionally and possibly physically if Jerry is still anywhere in her life. That would make you negligent, not compassionate.
Cut her off. Permanently. No guilt needed.
NTA you would be bad parents if you allowed your child to ah e relationship with her.
>Are we the assholes for depriving our son (and our future children) from a relationship with one of his grandmothers?
What is wrong with you? The fact that you even got back in contact with her makes you an asshole. What did you think would happen dragging your kid around an alcoholic that made your husband homeless?
Frankly June sounds like a terrible influence for your child at this point .
Poor judgement, drinking, making her own kid homeless etc.
I’d cut her out completely. I would invite family members to your house for Thanksgiving or Christmas if they want to come if they don’t no hard feelings. Obviously that excludes June.
If June died tomorrow and your husband had just one regret to re engage with her one last time, that has been done. You can move on with no regrets now and find peace in your decision to cut her off permanently.
NTA but you both need a therapist to help you navigate this stuff. You are both dealing with complex, deep trauma. Your husband should be screened for Complex PTSD and, if he has it, should find a therapist with experience treating C-PTSD. Eye movement desensitization and reprocessing (EMDR) therapy is the gold standard, but cognitive behavior therapy can help him understand the thought patterns that create behaviors.
Trauma therapy is a serious commitment. I highly recommend it, but I will caution that you get out what you put in. It requires you to think critically about your relationships and behaviors. It can be painful to heal old wounds. You have to unlearn decades of negative thinking, defensive behaviors, and trauma responses. Some people can never bring themselves to do all of this. Good trauma therapy will change your life in positive ways you literally cannot imagine when you’re trapped inside the cycle, but again, it’s work. I find many people are very passive about their health and just want quick solutions. Understandable, but unfortunately not how it works at this time. What your brain has learned, it must unlearn.
I agree with other commenters that she should not be part of his life but that’s a big, painful step, so I wouldn’t expect it to happen 100% overnight.
As for the idea that your child will be deprived of a grandparent…children learn from the behavior modeled by adults. The behavior June has modeled is manipulation, lying, selfishness, substance abuse, protecting an abuser over her son, and frankly, deep cruelty and indifference to her own child. Do you want your child learning that family relationships must be maintained, no matter how abusive, manipulative, and dishonest they are?
And also watch your back with the whole family because it seems they knew and didn’t tell you guys
Updateme!