Update(after talking to my siblings):
So, quick backstory: I’ve mentioned my sister before the one who got blocked after trying to help sort out some family drama. Let’s call her Beth. She ended up having a conversation with my brother (Joseph) and Ursula (another family member involved in all of this).
Beth didn’t know Ursula was going to be there, so she waited until she walked into the room. When she did, Beth greeted her with a simple “Hi,” and Ursula immediately snapped back with, “I don’t want to talk to you, and you shouldn’t be here.” Beth pushed back, saying she had every right to be there since she was given a key. Then Ursula threw out two accusations one from eight years ago (yes, really) and another that’s already been proven false.
Here’s the wild part: both Joseph and Ursula KNOW that second accusation is complete BS. It’s been debunked, and Beth had nothing to do with it. But Ursula still tried to spin it as if, somehow, it would make sense that the lie came from Beth even though it’s been fully cleared up. Total mental gymnastics.
The convo obviously went nowhere, and Beth left. A few hours later, Ursula started messaging Beth, saying she wasn’t being genuine and didn’t apologize. Beth didn’t engage, especially since she only showed up to try to clear the air and move forward. But Ursula just kept blowing up her phone, demanding an apology over and over again.
Later that night, Joseph talked to our other brother let’s call him Brian and told him that both he and Ursula felt “cornered” by Beth showing up unannounced. During their convo, it became clear that Joseph was seriously exaggerating what went down. He claimed Ursula was “attacked” and “belittled,” and also said he explained to Beth why she needed to apologize.
Except… he didn’t. Brian asked more questions and realized Joseph never actually told Beth why she was supposedly in the wrong just gave a vague recap of past events.
So now all of this is being relayed back to Beth so she can decide what to do next. Ursula’s still expecting an apology for how she felt treated back in December. And look I get that people are allowed to feel what they feel. But if there is going to be an apology, it should come from a place of honesty and personal reflection not guilt tripping or emotional manipulation just to glue the family back together.
Comments
Backup of the post’s body: Update(after talking to my siblings):
So, quick backstory: I’ve mentioned my sister before the one who got blocked after trying to help sort out some family drama. Let’s call her Beth. She ended up having a conversation with my brother (Joseph) and Ursula (another family member involved in all of this).
Beth didn’t know Ursula was going to be there, so she waited until she walked into the room. When she did, Beth greeted her with a simple “Hi,” and Ursula immediately snapped back with, “I don’t want to talk to you, and you shouldn’t be here.” Beth pushed back, saying she had every right to be there since she was given a key. Then Ursula threw out two accusations one from eight years ago (yes, really) and another that’s already been proven false.
Here’s the wild part: both Joseph and Ursula KNOW that second accusation is complete BS. It’s been debunked, and Beth had nothing to do with it. But Ursula still tried to spin it as if, somehow, it would make sense that the lie came from Beth even though it’s been fully cleared up. Total mental gymnastics.
The convo obviously went nowhere, and Beth left. A few hours later, Ursula started messaging Beth, saying she wasn’t being genuine and didn’t apologize. Beth didn’t engage, especially since she only showed up to try to clear the air and move forward. But Ursula just kept blowing up her phone, demanding an apology over and over again.
Later that night, Joseph talked to our other brother let’s call him Brian and told him that both he and Ursula felt “cornered” by Beth showing up unannounced. During their convo, it became clear that Joseph was seriously exaggerating what went down. He claimed Ursula was “attacked” and “belittled,” and also said he explained to Beth why she needed to apologize.
Except… he didn’t. Brian asked more questions and realized Joseph never actually told Beth why she was supposedly in the wrong just gave a vague recap of past events.
So now all of this is being relayed back to Beth so she can decide what to do next. Ursula’s still expecting an apology for how she felt treated back in December. And look I get that people are allowed to feel what they feel. But if there is going to be an apology, it should come from a place of honesty and personal reflection not guilt tripping or emotional manipulation just to glue the family back together.
I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.
You’ve gotta use some paragraph breaks. I managed to read this, but it was way harder than it needed to be.
Your brother is choosing the life he wants to lead. Now you get to choose how you want to live your life. Is it living in a state of drama with the lead actress writing the script as she goes along? Or is it in peace, where you decide your own story?
Just stop. Stop trying to be cool with people who clearly don’t respect you guys. It looks like y’all are begging for a relationship that’s dead in the water. I’m sorry, but that’s the truth. Your brother is lying to cover for his fiancée, and you’re still trying to make it work with him?
Let it go. Block them, go no contact, change your number whatever it takes. Stop giving energy to people who keep showing you they don’t care.
Take the advice from your previous post. Drop the rope.
Dont call them, don’t go to them let them get on with it.
It all sounds rather tiring.
girl your brother and his wife are treating the family like shit. let them have their marriage and her family and finally allow them to go. cut them off
Your brother has married someone who will delete his messages and aims to isolate him. Perhaps this is abuse?
Either way his fiancé is the problem. Go no contact with her but maybe establish a line of communication that she can’t edit to isolate him.
You need to let it go and move on. Your brother and Ursula clearly don’t want to be around yall. Just let them go. Focus on your other siblings and niblings. You have all poured enough energy into this they are determined not to get along and to misunderstand. Stop reaching out and respect their wishes chances are when they need something, they’ll be back.
INFO… Where did your sister walk into with a key?
Just tell them you are going no contact with them because they are exhausting. Just because someone if family doesn’t mean you have to like them and definitely doesn’t mean you have to put this much effort in.
NTA. But there’s really nothing more you can do. She is fully determined to keep him away from his family, and, at the moment, he is allowing this. Send one, FINAL message from you all, letting him know that you love and miss him, that you will always be there for him if he needs or wants you, but that, given the way the family is being treated, you are stepping back from initiating any further contact. Stress again that you will always love him.
Then step back.
Your family is not going to ‘win’ this battle, your crazy sil holds all of the cards.
The best thing all of you can do is block them both to stop giving oxygen to the hysteria, and just be there for your brother if he ever sees the light, and comes to his family for help.
Trying to keep up with this relationship is a waste of your mental energy. Doesn’t make sense trying to force relationship with people who actively dislikes you, even if you are related. Your brother is just as bad as SIL, he lies and makes no effort to be a part of your family. I’d say let him go. Stop engaging with them and live happily ever after.
Why are any of you still bothering with Ursula? It’s understandable that y’all want to maintain a relationship with your brother but he’s choosing her and her drama over your extended family, you can’t change that. Let them fade away for now and keep hope that your brother comes to his senses at some point. Sorry.
It’s time to stop trying with them it’s not going to change she loves drama and being the centre of attention.
Just try not to engage with them. Let them be your past.
Let it go. Let your brother know you’re there if he chooses to reach out and then stop. Don’t contact them. Don’t try to mediate or intervene. Your brother is a grown ass man and he’s chosen to support his partner. So let him go until he grows up abd reaches out
Why are you posting an update when your first post is only 6 hours old?
You all sound exhausting. Just leave each other alone. If they don’t want to be part of your lives then let them go.
/updateme
Updateme!
STOP. Just stop it. Your brother has already proven that his wife, no matter how awful of a liar she is, he will always stand by. So stop reaching out. Stop inviting. Stop engaging. She’s holding on the past to keep you guys out of their lives, so get out and leave their drama at their feet. You deserve better. Your mom and family do too. The day will come when he realizes how much she lies.
Let them go…. they have made it perfectly clear that no matter what you do or say , it will never be enough.
Just let your brother know that when he’s ready to talk properly he knows where you are.
Your loosing sleep over some thing you are never going to be able to fix with this woman.
She will always find problems where there’s none.
She’s isolating your brother, you have no magic wand just let him know you will be there if he needs you and close it down and move on, refuse to engage in the drama queens logic any more. Xxx
Just send him a message, tell him that you love him and you’ll be there for him if he needs it, but due to his fiancée’s behavior(give examples), you need to cut contact.
Tell him this for me, though: Ursula is a manipulative twat.
I don’t know why you keep trying? Are you all idiots?
If your brother wants to be NC, then give it to him. And when he comes crying back, ignore him.
Why are you all feeding into this energy?
You just need to block them and move on. There is nothing you can do. You cannot compete with the stories she has in her head
Just block them.
It doesn’t matter if anyone apologizes, she won’t accept it anyway. She will claim it is insincere like she did with your mother and keep bringing up whatever her issue is regardless. She is unwilling to move forward.
Why are you bothering with these people?
Aside from the fact they are nowt but drama, they clearly don’t want to be around your side of the family. Honestly, count it as a blessing, they sound like a right pair of cranks!
Your brother made his choice. It’s time for you to grow a spine and make yours.
Your original post said that your mother was blunt and not very tactful but not intentionally cruel. Did it occur to you that Ursula’s feelings may have been valid and that she genuinely was insulted? And then your entire family wouldn’t listen or support her, and accused her of lying? She may be distancing herself from the family because your mother may have been mean to her and the family thinks she should get over it because that is just how your mother is
And is she isolating your brother from his family or is he supporting his partner and going low contact with a toxic family?
There are two sides to every story and maybe Ursula is awful, but it’s also suspicious that your mother is described as blunt and tactless (which means rude) and when Ursula is upset at being treated rudely she is cast out as being an unhinged liar
It’s also hard to tell because the story doesn’t make a lot of sense. When Ursula told Beth that she shouldn’t be there and Beth said that she had a key, where was “there”? Was it Ursula’s home? How did Beth get a key? From the post it sounds like Beth went to your brother’s house unannounced, was asked to leave by Ursula (and they may have been in Ursula’s home) and Beth refused to leave. Your other brother then called Joseph and Joseph said that he felt cornered and “attacked” by Beth showing up unannounced but you are saying that Joseph was exaggerating what happened even though you weren’t there. If Beth showed up at Joseph’s house unannounced and uninvited, was asked to leave and refused, and then said she had a right to be there because she had a key, I would side with Joseph and Ursula
How is there an update after only 3 hours?
This is your brothers choice.
His life and his wife.
Keeping her pacified is more important to him than having a relationship with his family.
My partner’s family has an Ursula.
We stopped talking to them. His brother supports his wife.
We are polite at family gatherings (if they show up), and that’s it.
I suggest you do the same.
He made his choice to stick by Ursula no matter what. You should respect that and walk away.
Just fucking stop. Your brother is an adult who has made his choice of staying with drama queen. Stop engaging with her. Stop engaging with him. Just fucking stop. He will come around or not but none of you are going to fix this.
Just move on. They aren’t going to change, so let it go. Yes, it sucks not having your nephew in your lives, but his parents have shown you that they don’t want you to be. Stop engaging in the drama.
Mmmm. Too much pride and trying to stay connected to toxicity. I get it. My mom is not always great. She guilts you and denies half of my life because it would make her look bad. She doesn’t listen to what you’re saying and downplays your feelings. Sometimes, people suck.
So here are your options.
You can be truthfully kind. Tell your brother exactly what’s going on in the nicest way possible. Explain how she is a manipulative person trying to cut him off from his family. And let him decide.
You can do the same, but not nice. After a while of diplomacy, being real is the only thing that will work. Sometimes. Other times, they leave you, claiming you’re toxic. It’s a no-win in that case, but sometimes the hard truth is what a person needs.
You can just accept what’s going on, stop trying to win, and let her continue to manipulate, use your family, and get her way because you want to keep peace. Maybe one day, he will see what she’s doing because she has no ammo to say how mean you were being. But usually, this narcissists will lie and manipulate this situation anyway. Even when nothing occurs, so good luck with that.
The one you need to do is confront, be firm, but cordial, part ways.
Yep, you dont want to, i know, but you aren’t going to win. The more pressure you apply, the more ammo she has against you. Your brother, though intelligent as he may be, is very easily controlled and manipulated by her. He won’t see it, and if he does, it is rarely because something you said. Logic is not going to cut it here. Only actions will.
And that sucks. Because the only way you will get him back is to leave him alone. And this is a maybe at best. But of all the options, this is the one with the highest probability of working. And that means no more helping when there is no venue for their kids’ birthday.
The only time you should talk is if they are calling to reconcile. Otherwise, explain that you will no longer have your words twisted into a narrative that isn’t true just so she can “win” you against us. She wins. We aren’t playing a game that she is constantly changing the rules to to make us look like people we are not.
And when he says she is not trying to win anything, simply say, OK, and then go away. Do not engage any longer.
Yes, they will use this as you being cruel. But the alternative is going to make you look way worse.
Your parents are going to want to see their grandchild, so they will capitulate. That’s on them. You can only try to explain that the best route is to cut off the poison that is your sister in law. And that means your brother and family as well. Otherwise, she will infect all of you.
Will it take time, for sure. Will it work, maybe. Is it your best option, absolutely.
I’d tell your brother that I’ll be there for him when he chooses to get his head out of his ass but until then, bye
I have family just like Ursula. Just let them go, block and unfollow Ursula on everything. If your worried about your brother you can keep and open communication with him but she might use it so be careful.
I know it sounds hard but your family need to cut them off. You, your siblings and your parents are never going to win with her in his eyes. The relationship with your nephew and your brother is never going to work with her involved, she is always going to use them against you and your family not going to be able to overcome it with her.
Ursula wants to be a vicitm in your families story, and you guys just need to stop feeding her narrative.
Updateme
Ursula is the abuser here. She is projecting and god knows what she is doing to your brother and nephew behind closed doors. Eventually he will figure it out but it might be awhile. Let him know you love him no matter what and that your family will be there for him and lil red crocs if they ever need help. Ursula sounds like she might have a full on disorder such as borderline. There’s only so much you can do to reason w BPDs – their world is very black and white & they believe they are the world’s victim, lashing out and gaslighting constantly to “protect” themselves.
Ursula wants to hate you all and she’ll never stop. It’s not a misunderstanding, she’s causing drama on purpose and your family is fawning over her trying to “fix” things. Tell your brother you’ll be there for him when he’s had enough of being isolated from his family and have no more contact with her.
An apology will never fix this. Ursula has decided she is a victim and no amount of apology and groveling will ever change that.
Don’t argue with stupid or crazy. It will never get anywhere and only causes strife. I suggest you all turn your backs on them because clearly they aren’t reasonable.
Just tell your brother that you love him and you’re sorry that Ursula seems to want to put a wedge between all of you and isn’t willing to actually put anything behind you or meet in the middle in good faith. Just let him know that you’ll always be there for him, but that you can’t continue to fight for a relationship that has never been wanted or reciprocated.
You all need to stop. It’s clear that she’s controlling the narrative. She has a persecution complex and there’s nothing you will ever be able to say that will be good enough. She will continue to invent slights and insults and demand apologies and then reject those apologies as being insincere. You can get on your knees and grovel and it will not be sufficient. She wants to isolate your brother and your brother wants to be isolated. That is the key here. Your brother is an adult and this is what he is choosing. Even when you present him with evidence That she’s getting text messages that he’s getting invitations. He is choosing not to believe you he is choosing to ignore your messages. He is choosing to step out of your family group chat.
Your family needs to move on with your life. Stay close, visit, and try to feel complete without his presence. And maybe one day he’ll wake up to how truly manipulative his wife is. Maybe one day his eyes will be open and he will return to the family or he won’t. They will continue to live their live separate and apart from you and you won’t have the relationship with him or with your nephew that you wanted. It’s sad, but y’all need to figure out a way to accept it and move on. Because every reach out every attempt you make will be twisted into manipulation.
Why are you still chasing someone who doesn’t want a relationship with you?
Stop. 🛑.
Full stop. 🛑
Tell everyone who is ‘on your side’ to ABSOLUTELY go No Contact with Joseph.
It’s time for actions to meet consequences.
Joseph’s actions NEED consequences and no one is giving them to him. Because he’s not standing up for you Op, he needs to feel the weight of his DECISION to back the wrong person.
So BACK OFF. Stop responding to THEM.
Send one text:
When you are ready to LIVE in the truth and stand up for me, then contact me. I’m not apologizing to someone who knows The Truth and lied about the situation to fit their narrative. It’s been proven what Ursula says was A LIE. You know The Truth and kept your mouth shut — when you should’ve stood up for me. Contact me when you’re done with the drama. Because I’m completely done with your drama.
Hit send.
Don’t look back.
The problem is your brother. Stop trying to connect with them.
Just stop. Your brother is too far gone and Ursula will never be placated. She’s decided your family is bad and there will be no changing that. Let the toxicity take itself out. Sucks to lose a brother, I’m not saying that’s easy. But it’s a waste of your energy at this point. They are deluded
These to posts were truly exhausting and I’m not even part of that shituation (deliberate “typo”). Just tell Ursula and Joseph to stop with the BS and lies, and that they need to either apologise or face the consequences of their actions through LC/NC. You being the ones to “steady the boat” is fuelling their crazy.
Your brother has chosen her over his family, and at this time there is nothing you can do about it. It’s his right and his choice. All you can do is hope that one day he sees her for what she really is.
why do you want to go through so many hoops for a drama queen? block her and move on. your brother is blind for not seeing her game, but he made his choice by marrying her.
life is too short to waste any more time on drama queens
Dude… give it up already. The relationship is dead. It won’t magically become better if you keep flogging it. The work has to come from them, not you.
I feel like you’re beating a dead horse at this point. Drop the rope, he’ll either wake up one day and change course, or he won’t. Seems like by continuing to reach out, you’re prolonging everything.