Yet when you see their posts or comments, you will notice that they call themselves and each other very ugly. Sometimes they even go further and call themselves “subhuman” or “sub5” or some weird racial slur.
Is blaming their looks the easy answer to their non existent dating lives ? or they genuinely have body dysmphoria? Or it’s something else ?
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Because it’s often a self-image and self-confidence problem as much as anything.
They tend to get it in their head that if they don’t look like a movie star no one would ever want them and it’s easier to blame appearances they can’t control than to take accountability for being shitty people and make the effort to be a better person that people want to be around or date
in those cases I think it’s body dysmorphia + hivemind + denial. If you can convince yourself women only date very attractive people or very rich people or whatever, you can blame your genetics and luck and not have to reflect on what you might consider working on about yourself.
Some very likely have body dysmorphia, but for some blaming their looks is a way to blame something that they feel is out of their control AND blame women for not wanting to sleep with them. If they’re entirely average looking, they can and will sometimes make the argument that women only ever sleep with the top 10 or 5 or 1% of men in terms of looks, so it’s not THEIR fault, it’s their average looks and women’s fault.
In some cases it really is just crippling self confidence issues and a very unrealistic view of their own body, so they genuinely see themselves as incredibly ugly or sub human.
In some cases it’s also a matter of not knowing how to groom and style themselves, and it can be hard to see yourself as potentially attractive if you don’t realize what a difference being clean and wearing well fitting clothes and a flattering haircut can make.
A lot of it is due to either being too anxious to do anything at all, or having a few bad experiences early on and internalizing them. Add in that some of them are probably aiming too high and things can snowball pretty quickly.
Then once the mental illness sets in they are unattractive because of their behavior and attitude, not their face.
THIS. Like a lot of the times, they are actually genuinely physically attractive men!
If only they weren’t chronically online in probably some of the worst online spaces possible, they could have success IRL. It’s really sad to witness.
This is how they have been made to feel.
>Yet when you see their posts or comments, you will notice that they call themselves and each other very ugly. Sometimes they even go further and call themselves “subhuman”. Is blaming their looks the easy answer to their non existent dating lives ? or they genuinely have body dysphoria? Or it’s something else ?
I think some of them are simply fishing — they want someone to tell them they’re good looking, or normal (which then opens an avenue for them to argue). Others want to blame that, so they’ll do that. If only they were good looking (because women are shallow bitches/Chad/yada), then… and then if you say they are, see above.
Others some combination thereof, also with the issue of comparing themselves to movie stars or whatever, and then spending all their time staring at selfies and the mirror and going through forums to find idiotic anatomical stuff to obsess over to help them think they’re smarter than average (my philtrum is 3cm short of average and thus I’ll never …).
Because on the dating apps, women don’t even respond to guys who are below 8.
People have no confidence, I frame myself as a creep and ugly because I have no self confidence left after many years of rejection, the incel group have found a community that they feel like they fit in so they embrace it but still can’t help getting positive feedback
That’s because it’s their personality that’s causing their issues, but it’s easier to believe otherwise.
Because it’s a mental illness. Internalized hatred. Vulnerable people listening to toxic messaging. It’s a vile soup that gets them to this place.
They need help but until they realize that, you can’t really help them.
I’ve noticed that. It seems like the anorexics who see themselves as fat when they aren’t.
Because they spend all their time online and don’t realize that normal life and normal people aren’t made up people they see in movies or AI. But they are pretty pathetic.
People don’t just become incels. No teenage boy is like I hate women,Let me become an incel.
Maybe they’re 15 and they try asking out a girl on a date and they get denied. Okay they say so they try to dress better. Maybe they join a sports team. Then they try again and get denied again. Then they think okay Well I’m just start going to the gym. They do that and they lose some weight and gain some muscle. This takes a lot of effort and they’re pretty confident now because they’ve put in all of this effort. So they try again and again and again and they still get denied. By this point they are probably ending high school and are starting to become demoralized. They think okay. Well maybe it’s just money with something like that. So they go all in in college and then do really well and get a good paying job. How long this path? They try a few more times and even afterwards again and still get denied. At this point they give up hope. Now they’re 22 to 24 and are so lonely that the simple coping mechanisms they used to use no longer even work. Then they just stew in it. Sometimes for years and sometimes for decades. All while society tells them to just do better.
There are many off ramps to becoming an incel at each of these stages. Some go further than others before they reach that point. But nobody starts off there. Getting there is a process of constant rejection and demoralization.
Some people reach that stage of demoralization and don’t start to hate people while others do. I’m somebody who doesn’t hate women but is pretty demoralized. What I wish society understood is that people do try. They do go to counseling and all sorts of other ways of doing better. It seldom ever works. My theory is birth control is proven to change how women are attracted to men and cultural hegemony pushes certain looks via the media rather than allowing natural emergence of attentive behavior.
Every single incel in the world could get a gf if he really wanted to, but he doesn’t want to accept that it requires actively working to make himself a better person from the inside out, he wants pussy and everything else served to him on a plate garnished with misogyny and entitlement, so instead he allows himself to be convinced by scammers and grifters that the REAL problem is something completely out of his control (some freakish combo of his genetics and social class). This spirals into a sad, pathetic, hateful community of otherwise totally average dudes wallowing in learned helplessness and shared mental illness, propped up and kept alive by people who $$$ profit big time off of manufacturing male misery.
It’s more behavior than appearance
The content they consume convinces them they’re worthless — especially if they’re struggling with dating. Before all that, they were just regular guys with social skills, building their careers. But this ideology creates problems that wouldn’t even exist if they hadn’t gotten hooked on all that self-proclaimed ‘alpha male’ nonsense and its toxic mindset
This is because the ones who are truly ugly do not post pictures of themselves. Everyone that you see online who wasn’t posted by someone else without their consent thought they could show their face without getting insulted.
I think at a certain point the self pity turns to loathing and then their personality sucks
It’s because their dicks are small and they aren’t showing you a picture of that
Because it’s all in their heads.
They’re brainwashed into thinking women don’t want them because they’re not 7 foot tall muscley millionaires when, in reality, women actually don’t want them because they act like fucking incels.
Get rejected or bullied, and you develop body dismorphia. Same has in girls. Boys just don’t have any social circle or a net of friends to catch them like most girls have. All male bonding is deemed toxic. So they find the most toxic one out there. Because if it’s all toxic, it does not matter that they go all the way.
They would rather blame it on their looks (external and out of their control) than their personality or way of being (internally and within their control)
It absolves them of any responsibility and allows them to deflect blame on to all around them than either accept their personality as it is or change it.
I know some people who seem to think you’re either beautiful or ugly. They refuse to believe most people are average looking people. They work in extremes. If they don’t look like models then they’re ugly. If they aren’t getting dates it must be because of things “outside of their control” including being ugly.
The fact that they look like a normal, average person and that most relationships are composed of normal, average people is something they refuse to accept. They are blind to the fact that their family members and the people they see walking by just look normal.
I think most incels initially think they’re average looking. I think it’s a spiral stemming from the feedback loop of continuously making changes to their bodies and personalities but still getting not female attention.
Very often it’s a cycle that takes them deeper and deeper into those feelings, as well as negative attitudes that get worse and worse. This can go on for years. Women, generally, prefer pre-selected men. They know there is much less chance of something clingy happening if they all just share the same guy between 3 or 4 of them.
So the incel will try to look more normal, dress better, smell better, be richer, work out, it doesn’t matter. They are trying to do the wrong things.
A lot of incels are perfectly normal men, who aren’t socially calibrated because they don’t get the chance to do so. So they look normal. But if you are a woman who tried to date one you wouldn’t feel in competition, and you’d probably be worried they’ll get too attached.
Redditors: What did you want, me to lie? How much nicer could I have explained this. Sad.
Ironically, it’s self-assurance. Assurance that their failures in life all come down to being genetically “doomed” and not within their control. It alleviates any onus of self-reflection on how they conduct themselves as a person. (“Don’t worry man, it’s just because you have “prey eyes” or no jaw or whatever the fuck). You have been given the certification of official victim. Enjoy.
Its true, it’s so weird. There’s been so many guys where I’m like, oh they’re good looking–then they sprew some incel shit and I go, nevermind they’re ugly.
It’s definitely some kind of mental illness at play.
It’s incredibly tragic, these people are, in fact, in the situation they report to be: they are miserable, and it’s not their choice. They simply misdiagnosed the cause, it’s a mental health problem rather than an appearance / money / e-fame issue.
Add in the fact that due to the current political climate, these people are “ok to hate”, and you have yourself a recipe for a group that sees itself as outcast, misunderstood and without any hope for improvement. Most people in this thread aren’t helping.
Mommy issues. She didn’t do enough for “us”, including the father.
100% the same as daddy issues for a woman. And by the same, I mean by gender… daddy didn’t do enough for us.
They think they’re being rejected for their ugly faces- the woman’s fault, instead of their shitty personality- their fault
Possibly a coping mechanism so they don’t have to admit that they are insufferable bores who spent their formative years learning every facet of their fave japanese cartoon instead of being present in the real world and learning to talk to people.
Coupled with an internet echo chamber that encourages them to believe that they are smarter than they actually are… well, you end up with an uninteresting person who doesn’t know how to make small-talk and dismisses anyone’s opinion that differs from theirs or that they don’t understand.
Incel just means involuntary celibate. Involuntary means “not done by choice” and celibate means “abstaining from sex/marriage” (and abstain means choosing not to do something)
Take it all together and all incels are, by definition, are people who don’t get/have sex/marriage through no choice of their own.
So yeah of course that’s gonna include normal and good looking people (it includes anyone, really).
I’m an incel by definition, yet I don’t have or exhibit any of the negative stereotypes associated with incels. I’m a normal good well adjusted guy who just happens to not get any interest from others (anymore). As they say, “it is what it is” and control what you can control and don’t worry about the rest.
They often do not have the ability to recognize that they’re not ugly. They associate failure with relationships and failure socially with their appearance. It’s usually a mental issue, not physical (though it certainly CAN be physical if they are indeed fat/ugly/etc).
Most often they get excluded or ostracized or picked last as young kids, and that rejection gets burned into their mind and slowly eats them from the inside out. And after that happens, even if they have a “glow up”, they usually don’t know.
It’s all mental and sometimes finance issue. Even Stephen Hawking was cheating on his wife with his nurse.
Dating standards tend to be higher among genz, also you could be overrating them
A different perspective, but I’m a tall woman. I was extremely insecure about this in my teenage years, and I was genuinely convinced that everyone hated me for it, I would never find love or even good friendships because of this one thing that made me stand out from everyone else that I couldn’t change.
And everything was confirmation of this insecurity to me. Someone doesn’t seem interested in my offer to hang out sometimes? Must be because they’d feel to weird hanging out with a girl who’s way taller. Tinder person doesn’t want a second date? Of course, they freaked out after meeting me because of my height. Trouble connecting to people? Height. Someone not holding the door open for me? Laughing when I walk by? Ignoring me in a group convo?.. You get the picture.
Now I got over this, (combination of finding some great friends, and therapy to learn that not everyone has to like me for me to be a person with worth) but I can imagine if there had been online places validating my insecurities I could have totally been sucked in.
They think no one wants to have sex with them because of their appearance, but it’s actually their personality that’s the problem.
Side question, where do you normally see people calling themselves incels?
I am a very hot girl. I was in a situationship with a guy (I wanted to be bf/gf, he didn’t) while he became red pill in 2017. He was addicted to porn and rarely touched me. Like didn’t touch me for months even though I slept naked in his bed. He was 6 foot, dark hair and handsome. Blue eyes. He looks like John Travolta in his prime. His family is awesome (I’ve met them), upper middle class, paid for his elite college education. But somehow it wasn’t enough. He wanted to be angry. He wanted to be the victim.
For incels, the problem is usually not their looks. It may be due to poor socialization, combined with a sense of entitlement and a tendency to push people’s boundaries and make others uncomfortable. This makes them unattractive to women. Incels believe it has to do with their physical looks, but it’s generally the vibe they give off.
The same reason you often see very unattractive people in relationship. They tell themselves people don’t like them because of their looks but it’s actually about personality
A lot of them probably have body dysmorphia and/or incredibly low self-esteem, and have been indoctrinated into a harmful community as a result of that vulnerability. It’s sad really.
But it seems like for a lot of them, it’s easier to blame their appearance for women’s lack of interest in them than actually confronting the truth: it’s their personality and beliefs that make them extremely off-putting to us.
But recognising that would take self-reflection and working on themselves, and that’s difficult. It’s much easier to avoid all accountability by blaming their appearance and branding all women as shallow. And because they’re stuck in an echo chamber that reinforces their delusion, they’re unwilling to accept reality.
And a lot of incels who do try to improve themselves only do so with the intention of having sex or getting a girlfriend, which defeats the purpose and means they’ve not really made any progress at all.
It’s a mental problem, they despise female. It doesn’t happen to guys with good hair or nice teeth just bc they can’t get a gf. They have a psychotic hatred of all women which their poorly wired brains turn into sexually fueled rage. You’re asking how short the skirt of the rape victim was. Got nothing to do with normal, got to do with their damaged brain function.
It’s because it is very rarely so that incels are actually not getting laid because of their looks. They blame their looks, often due to low self-esteem, as a substitute for being garbage humans that treat others like crap and expect to have things handed to them, whilst living in their cellar and not realizing that people way less conventionally attractive than them get laid all the time.
they often lack self esteem
Because anyone can be insecure, and anyone can hold resentments in their head.
I am gay so it might not fully line up but. People who I find unattractive regularly tell me I am attractive. But it’s super rare for anyone who I am attracted to to find me attractive. And the guys who I end up falling for never return my feelings . Even the ones who I have hooked up with all vanish. I find myself miserable and full of hatred for the world.
All to do with self confidence and no strong role models
Because the actual ugly ones aren’t posting pictures of themselves on the internet like that, the only ones that do are aware they’re not that ugly.
Well I think the way the world treats them and talks about them is 70% of the problem
It’s easy to think you’re ugly when nobody but your mom tells you otherwise. I didn’t think I was attractive until my now girlfriend said I was
They’d rather believe something they can’t control is why women aren’t interested because they have 0 responsibility to make an effort to be a more attractive option as a partner. Acknowledging your personality might be the problem, and working to improve yourself takes more effort than believing that only rich guys and sexy dudes with sick abs are getting laid. They’re lazy and uncurious by nature, which is why they gravitate towards an ideology that confirms their preconceived biases and makes their shortcomings society’s fault.
It’s easier to blame women for being “shallow” than to acknowledge their horrible personalities.
You don’t need to be hideous for you to never be called handsome ever in your entire life. And at that point how do you really know that you aren’t hideous.
They refuse to understand that woman have more than looks in mind while looking for a partner. They can be the best looking guy in the world, but when they open your mouth and the misogyny spew out, it’s a big turnoff.
Their issue isn’t that aren’t handsome enough but that they can’t see that looks aren’t everything.
Because their visual appearance isn’t the underlying cause of social leprosy.
There are about 800K more males than females in the 29-34 age category, the biggest among age groups. So that is just math…
Because the problem isn’t always them being ugly on the outside.
Most of the pictures I see are of ugly looking guys. I think maybe you are looking at joke posts where a good looking guy posts a picture of himself and ironically calls himself a subhuman.
I have tried to help incels but I just stopped. It’s always the same. It’s their personality that is the problem and the entitledment. You try to give advice like ” try to do something else than just sit at home and watch anime and shower” and usually the answer is “NO! Why should I have to change just please some filthy whore!”
It’s more convenient to blame things they can’t change, like height or “canthal tilt” which is thing only incels know about and maybe cosmetic surgeons.
Ok buddy, don’t change then. But this is just how the game works. If people can’t stand being around you then you will be alone. And your personality is insufferable, it’s not because you are 1 inch too short.
Because for some reason, your mind wants to create a false image of what they should look like. They say almost 90% of the South Korean male population are incels or incel adjacent. In Japan I don’t know but it’s also pretty high. With those extremely growing numbers, it would be hard for them not to look like regular people after a while